jehovah window cleaners

[Neil nowdownunder]

But a page ago, people were saying Jesus did not exist.

Do you now accept he did exist? Agree there is more debate about "was Jesus the Son of God" but people who say there is no evidence that Jesus existed clearly have never looked into it very deeply.

 

[Neil nowdownunder]

If anyone would love a good debate about this then consider doing an Alpha course...

http://www.alpha.org/try

There is NO "Bible bashing" and your free to say what you feel.

 

[Dave B]

"Evolution has never been observed."

Biologists define evolution as a change in the gene pool of a population over time. One example is insects developing a resistance to pesticides over the period of a few years. Even most Creationists recognize that evolution at this level is a fact. What they don't appreciate is that this rate of evolution is all that is required to produce the diversity of all living things from a common ancestor.

The origin of new species by evolution has also been observed, both in the laboratory and in the wild. See, for example, (Weinberg, J.R., V.R. Starczak, and D. Jorg, 1992, "Evidence for rapid speciation following a founder event in the laboratory."Evolution 46: 1214-1220). The "Observed Instances of Speciation" FAQ in the talk.origins archives gives several additional examples.

Even without these direct observations, it would be wrong to say that evolution hasn't been observed. Evidence isn't limited to seeing something happen before your eyes. Evolution makes predictions about what we would expect to see in the fossil record, comparative anatomy, genetic sequences, geographical distribution of species, etc., and these predictions have been verified many times over. The number of observations supporting evolution is overwhelming.

What hasn't been observed is one animal abruptly changing into a radically different one, such as a frog changing into a cow. This is not a problem for evolution because evolution doesn't propose occurrences even remotely like that. In fact, if we ever observed a frog turn into a cow, it would be very strong evidence against evolution.

 

[Jake]

lol Dave,

Copy and pasting from Google is not a good idea,

if you actually look into and research those points, you will quickly find that none of what you have copied proves evolution from one species to another.

All we see is variations within the kind, never a new species, dogs always produce dogs etc etc etc

If you want some info then his will help

http://humansarefree.com/2013/12/9-scienctific-facts-prove-theory-of.html?m=0

The insects and pesticides has been shown to be complete rubbish years ago, do some research on it, I learnt about that in 2009.

 

[Dave B]

So obviously we came into being 4000 years ago when the earth was created then

The dinosaurs never existed

And we all come from adam and eve

 

[steve garwood]

Cor, you've been convinced easily Davey boy. Lol

 

[Jake]

No idea what your on about now, dinosaurs existed of course,

Either you believe we came from a rock. Or you believe in creation,

Doesn't bother me Dave,

Just don't copy and paste things from Google!/emoticons/biggrin.png

 

[Dave B]

No I'll just stick a link up instead hey..you must be right as the link you posted says so but you didn't copy and paste it

 

[Jake]

I gave you the link because of your original post about evolution Dave, its a good article and worth a read,

You just went a googled a topic and then pasted it in as if you know about it, you don't, otherwise you wouldn't have pasted that particular argument,

No need to get offended,

The fact is, it's not proven, so it takes faith to believe in evolution and the Big Bang theory

 

[Jake]

When dowrnachs back online he'll go ballistic again, and post about 50 anti religion posts...

This thread will just drag on and on and on, so I'm gonna concentrate on the actual purpose of the forums now, rather than debates about religion...

All I'll end with is through much learning, research and study, time again evouktion is debunked.

And it takes a lot of faith to believe in a Big Bang, as does religion.

That's the end of it for me, back to window cleansing discussion now.

happy debating people! And enjoy your weekend /emoticons/biggrin.png

 

[tonyc]

great thread all.here is a bit of my views on this topic. over the years i have been seriously involved with many different paths or religions.here i name some. children of god.catholic. jehovah witness. evangelical. scientology.i was allways looking for the answer and meaning to life and with all these groups seemed at the time to have the answer being young and not so young i joined all these groups. sincerely each time thinking that i had found the answer or truth. however after various lengths of time in each .i came to realise that this was not for me .the hardest thing is to leave some of these groups its like a venus fly trap now days it feels like i have kind of gone a full circle i didnt find what i was looking for and i looked in lots of other places too philosophy ect .but now i am 60 and looking at life from experience.religion can bring out the very best and the very worst in people. i my self now am enjoying having the freedom to think for myself and and have my own moral standards that do not involve hitting children feeling superior to women and believing anyone who doesnt think the same as me is lost, wrong, or a threat (behind the scenes thats the actual practice of some of these groups allthough it gets sugar coated to sound like its something else).if anything science has and is answering most of my questions about life i do not know what happens when we die but if anything does i think our personal energy how kind and loving we are has some thing to do with the bigger picture if there is one.

 

[Diwrnach]

Oh wow, OK so let me get this straight, you have done research for years and found NO PROOF at all of evolution, none? yet you have found proof Jesus exists, just, wow?

Ok first off there is none, not one proof of Jesus, none, there are accounts written by a Roman YEARS after his death that Christians clung to but those were begunked years ago as fake, I can't be arsed to search but think his name was Tacitus or something like that, that is the ONLY proof ever found and was proved false.

Secondly Jake you don't science do you? at all? no missing links found? really? we have now I think about 5 or more "missing links" we are finding them fairly regular, and as for not witnessing evolution, again just because you fail at science and reading doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

Here is a link to a lizard that was introduced to an island and within a few years MUCH shorter than scientists ever believed possible evolved a new digestive system http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2008/04/080421-lizard-evolution.html

Now here is one that's going to twist your melon, HUMANS are evolving NOW, do you know why so many people are lactose intolerant? because we originally couldn't drink milk and had to more or less force ourselves, it used to make us ill, over several generations most of us have evolved to drink milk, while some are still intolerant to it.

We are losing our wisdom teeth, our jaws have over many years slowly got smaller and smaller making wisdom teeth something we don't need, some of us have to have them yanked out as there isn't room for them, some now never grow them at all.

We are resisting diseases, we now resists diseases that would of killed us or made us very ill a thousand years ago, Living in cities has produced a genetic variant that allows us to be more resistant to diseases like tuberculosis and leprosy. "This seems to be an elegant example of evolution in action," says Dr. Ian Barnes from the School of Biological Sciences at Royal Holloway.

For the last 30'000 years our brains have been shrinking.

We have blue eyes, up to around 10,000 years ago we all had brown eyes, then a genetic mutation developed in the black sea and it got passed down.

How about in Africa elephants are now being born more regularly without tusks? this is because poachers don't kill the rare genetic mutatonsd born without, this used to be very rare but is in fact now really common as they survive and those with tusks don't passing down genes to not have tusks.

You ask about transitional species, the last bastion of the religious who believe we were made from ribs and magic rather than natural selection, I'll let you in on a secret, EVERYTHING is in transition, every animal including us is slowly evolving, always, we ARE transitional.

 

[Diwrnach]

Here is a link it took 2 secs to find that lists THE TOP TEN MISSING LINKS http://www.livescience.com/11326-top-10-missing-links.html

 

[Diwrnach]

List of transitional fossils https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_transitional_fossils

 

[Diwrnach]

National Geographic missing links http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2009/02/photogalleries/darwin-birthday-evolution/

 

[Diwrnach]

OK here is a really important one, please check this list, List of natural scientists who became creationists after obtaining their PhD http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/List_of_scientists_who_became_creationists_after_studying_the_evidence

 

[Diwrnach]

To deny evolution is insanity, it is the most proved theory in the whole of science, it has more proof and is more understood than gravity.

 

[Diwrnach]

You can disagree as much as you like doesn't mean you're right, does the sand make your head itch?

 

[Diwrnach]

Oh also forgot earlier on I forget who said the Sinai bible is the oldest kind James, man, you guys don't know squat about your own damn religion?

It is the OLDEST bible ever found, it was written about 2-300 years after Jesus was supposed to have lived. It has no mention of mary being impregnated by god, to give birth to himself to latter sacrifice himself to himself.

It pretty much be dunks the whole Christian faith.

 

[Diwrnach]

Here, read about the oldest Christian bible, nothing to do with King James, wow...... http://www.vatileaks.com/vati-leaks/a-glaring-omission-in-world-s-oldest-bible

 

[Diwrnach]

I'm actually amazed we have creationists in the UK, blows my mind really.

Even the bloody pope agrees with evolution and the big bang lol