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Neilmnwc

Pump or battery problem?

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Neilmnwc

Hi,

I'm currently using a 110ah lead acid wet cell leisure battery, but I'm finding I can get about a day at a push before the water pressure drops and eventually stops.

I've had the battery checked (it was bought in Jan 16) a couple of months ago which was fine, I've changed to Manual pump controller to try and rectify to no avail. The pump is a Shurflo 100psi & is nearly three years old. Does this sound like battery or pump fault? I'm stuck.

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noddy

I run two 115psi pumps on mine today and used 1100lts off water of two blocks of flats , van never moved once and they were fine , o a single 110 battery that's three years old and never been charged in the house ever

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spruce

Unfortunately this isn't an easy problem to solve.

 

One of the Shurflo pumps on our van is used daily and is nearly 11 years old. We have 3 more; one is 8 years old, the other is 7 years old and the third is 5 years old. But that doesn't mean that yours isn't faulty. It only means that ours have lasted a long time without failures.

 

How are you charging your battery, what charger are you using, what make of leisure battery are you using, what controller did have and what controller have you now? How often do you charge your battery?

 

Are you using those 'crocodile' clamps on the battery? Have you got a good joins in the cable and are the fuseholders ok?

 

If you are on your second controller with the same issues, then I would be inclined to look elsewhere first, although never entirely discounting the controller.

 

My first look would be the battery. So what you could do is take a fused cable of good current capacity (say 20 amp) and run it from your van battery to your controller and pump. As a test it doesn't have to be routed properly as its only temporary.

(We found on 3 separate occasions that a Citroen Berlingo van and a Ford Connect's batteries would last 3 days before going flat powering the pumps with very little traveling time.)

 

If you have a split charge relay connected to your leisure battery, then you would be better able to see if the problem disappeared when you started the engine and ran the pump. So if you don't have a SCR then you could run the system off your van battery for a couple of days and see if the same issue occurs with your pump. Do take a pair of jumper cables out with you. Also make sure that the negative cable from the controller has a good connection to the van body. (When the first leisure battery on my van failed we were doing a large job out of area. After an hour our fully charged leisure battery died. We ran the van's engine for another couple of hours so we could finish the job. Replacing that battery solved the problem.)

 

If the system works fine off your van's starter battery, then the battery is suspect. However, my previous experience would tell me to just go and buy a good quality leisure battery and forget the messing on.

 

You could also take your fully charged leisure battery to Halfords and ask them to put their battery tester on it. This is probably what I would do. What the tester does is puts a load onto the battery to see how it reacts. Unfortunately there are testers and testers in the same way as there are salesmen and con salesmen. You need to watch that the tester does do a proper evaluation of the battery, rather than just saying the battery is faulty so they can sell you a new one.

 

 

Like Noddy, our leisure batteries seem to get to a good age although we do very little mileage and have to regularly supplementary charge the leisure batteries.

 

In the past 8 years I am onto my third leisure battery in my van mount. Both the previous batteries were replaced when they didn't do us a days work, and that cured the problem.

.

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Neilmnwc
Unfortunately this isn't an easy problem to solve.

 

Thanks for the replies. I went for the cheapest, most powerful battery I could get hold of...when I had it tested it was done over 24hrs (enough to have ratified the guarantee requirements from the supplier) but found to be ok, although like you said it still may be the battery.

 

I have no SCR fitted and charge the battery every night at the moment as I cannot trust it. When new it would last for a good three days between charges, but pushing it for the third day. Charger wise I went from using a dirt cheap green flag/maypole charger to a Ctek one more recently to try and eliminate that. (could it be the old charger had don't the damage already?).

 

I'll have a look at the wiring, the joins are all tight, but I've got plenty of joins in the cable using spade connectors (would this make a difference?).

using the push on spring type connectors rather than croc clips.

 

...Like you said a new battery, maybe a better quality one (how do you tell, other than brand?) might sort it.

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Duncs

i had same problem two pumps running three yrs old

pump fluked, changed the pump hayho top dollar all well

i was getting problems getting the pump to go in morning thought it was air locks

then it totally died the death

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noddy

you can test your pumps with a stop watch and a bucket with ltr making on the side , I bin ours after two years of work

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spruce

I would buy a battery where you have some sort of warranty that is worth something.

 

Other cleaners rate the Halfords battery and warranty.

 

We have had excellent service from Numax leisure batteries - one 85 amph unit is now 5 + years old. However, Numax have categorically told me that they will not honour warranty on their leisure batteries to window cleaners because we 'abuse' them which makes their warranty null and void. (I don't buy that tbh as the normal motor home/caravan user probably hammers his battery off grid more than we do. But, as most motor homes and caravans are plugged into a mains supply on site, its my guess that they overlook the off site/wild camping issues that occasionally occur as policing and justifying not honouring a warranty is too complicated. Its easier to lump all window cleaners into a category and refuse all warranty claims, even if they are genuine.)

 

I currently have an Oldham 110 amph leisure battery in my van. I prefer this one as it can be topped up with water. Its nearly 2 years old and still performing perfectly.

 

Several cleaners around our parts bought Lion leisure batteries and didn't get good service from them. Lion refused warranty claims. I also replaced my van battery with a Lion and it failed within the warranty period. The manufacturers of the Lion brand refused the warranty as the battery had served its purpose.

 

I'm not one to let unscrupulous suppliers give me an ulcer so I will never buy that product again and will advise others not to buy them either.

 

.

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spruce

If your pumps work fine first thing in the morning but not later on, then this tells me that the pumps are working fine. A faulty pump would start to give trouble right from the early morning I believe.

 

I'm biased toward Shurflo pumps as we have never had a failure in the 11 years we have been wfp.

 

.

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♠Winp®oClean♠

IMO it's unlikely to be the pump. It will most likely be a battery or electrical connection issue. Check all connections. Many a good pump has been replaced due only to the actual pump connections and not the pump itself.

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Neilmnwc

Cheers all, I've got a different battery to try now & will see how that goes (I may have hammered the battery by draining it too often shortening its life...).

 

 

Sent using the Window Cleaning Forums mobile app

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spruce
Cheers all, I've got a different battery to try now & will see how that goes (I may have hammered the battery by draining it too often shortening its life...).

 

 

Sent using the Window Cleaning Forums mobile app

 

Leisure batteries don't last if they are drained below 50% of charge. Will be interesting to hear the final result as we can all chalk it up to experience.

 

.

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Neilmnwc
Leisure batteries don't last if they are drained below 50% of charge. Will be interesting to hear the final result as we can all chalk it up to experience.

 

.

Mine was exhausted then, I was (wrongly) under the impression you could drain them flat...you live and learn. Lasted 9 months.

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spruce
Mine was exhausted then, I was (wrongly) under the impression you could drain them flat...you live and learn. Lasted 9 months.

 

The problem is that the suppliers are at fault. They say that a battery is good for X number of cycles. Users can be excused for thinking that a cycle is a full charge to full discharge. Afterall, what does "Deep cycle" leisure battery imply to most people?

 

Some of the battery suppliers really do go to extremes when it comes to expected cycles to give their battery a marketing advantage. I was reading that one quoted a really high cycle number, but the small print said that cycles could be achieved provided the battery wasn't discharged to below 80% capacity.

 

I also doesn't help us either as a cold battery working just above freezing will already loose 25% of its capacity.

 

.

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Neilmnwc

Hi everyone, Just to update and conclude this thread, I have changed the battery (45ah AGM battery bought second hand as a get by, Tested at 99%). Seems to have done the trick, no loss of power towards the end of the day , seems to have more guts in it. Time will tell & I won't drain a leisure battery right down now, despite what the inflated claims are...thanks all for input.

 

 

Sent using the Window Cleaning Forums mobile app

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