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Ana

Looking into pump boxes

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Ana

Hi guys 

 

I'm currently a one man band, working with a gardiner backpack and several 25 litre barrels daily. While this option has given me the ability to become self employed again (for which I'm very grateful) on a budget I'm keen to try other options that would help me save time mauling with barrels and carrying backpacks here and there. Im fit and able to lift barrels with ease and also carry 12 barrels per day in the van and it's plenty, have made a frame work to keep them together while on the move so there's little movement.

 

i don't want a fully fitted van system, my van is used for work and play so it's not a option to have something screwed in. After seeing what others have done using a gardiner back pack I've started to look into doing something similar but keeping my pack for those hard to get areas.

 

id like some thoughts and suggestions on this.

 

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.co.uk%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F113409883066

 

it seems quite handy and could be plugged into my barrels pretty easy, possibly splitting the intake line into two barrels? With the flow rate at 70 psi I'm also wondering how much hose it could handle meter wise? I would also need a hose reel, again one I quite like is here.

 

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.co.uk%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F264288280876

 

any and all advice is welcome 

 

dave

 

 

 

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wezza13

I use those pump boxes that you've linked. Also carry 12 x 25l water butts, 300 litres is more than enough for the days work. 

 

On my setup, I use nearly 100 metres of Gardiner yellow PVC 8mm hose which is on a Hozelock hose reel. Water flow isn't a problem. The pumpbox has a variable flow rate and I use it on the second setting. 

 

Using this setup is ultra-portable and, as long as you can personally walk somewhere, the kit can go with you. No trailing hoses across pavements is a big plus IMO.

 

Btw, you wouldn't need to split the intake line into two barrels - the flow rate is fine from one barrel.

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spruce
Posted (edited)
10 hours ago, Ana said:

Hi guys 

 

I'm currently a one man band, working with a gardiner backpack and several 25 litre barrels daily. While this option has given me the ability to become self employed again (for which I'm very grateful) on a budget I'm keen to try other options that would help me save time mauling with barrels and carrying backpacks here and there. Im fit and able to lift barrels with ease and also carry 12 barrels per day in the van and it's plenty, have made a frame work to keep them together while on the move so there's little movement.

 

i don't want a fully fitted van system, my van is used for work and play so it's not a option to have something screwed in. After seeing what others have done using a gardiner back pack I've started to look into doing something similar but keeping my pack for those hard to get areas.

 

id like some thoughts and suggestions on this.

 

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.co.uk%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F113409883066

 

it seems quite handy and could be plugged into my barrels pretty easy, possibly splitting the intake line into two barrels? With the flow rate at 70 psi I'm also wondering how much hose it could handle meter wise? I would also need a hose reel, again one I quite like is here.

 

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.co.uk%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F264288280876

 

any and all advice is welcome 

 

dave

 

 

 

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/264288280876?ul_noapp=true

 

This looks like an electric cable reel/drum. If it is then its no use for what you want it for.

 

It needs to be for water hose.

 

These were quite popular with window cleaners.

https://gardinerpolesystems.co.uk/all-products/pump-hose/hose-reels/lightweight-metal-reels/lightweight-metal-freestanding-microbore-hose-reel.html

 

The pump box has no inlet strainer on it. Personally I believe this is important. Gardiners will not give a warranty of a pump if it hasn't been used inconjunction with a prefilter, so its necessary extra they have omitted.

 

This is more expensive but is probably a better deal. It has a superior pump and Spring controller.

https://www.thecleaningwarehouse.co.uk/genie-in-a-box---pump-box-by-the-water-genie-2277-p.asp

Adding a battery will set you back £300. Its a decent size 85amp leisure battery.

 

 

Edited by spruce

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Apw1210

Im building a few pump & battery boxes for friend's plus two full trolley builds 

 

It's better making your own kit 

20190618_195031.jpg

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Ana
Posted (edited)

Cheers for the thoughts guys.

 

i have considered a diy pump box @Wind o kleen and @Apw1210 and although I'm competent at doing electrics I'd sooner buy in a ready made system for windows, it's just a personal choice really. However, if you guys want to link me to the bits and bobs I'd need to make one I can at least price it up and perhaps have a bash, really don't know what I'd need?

 

the idea behind splitting the hose @wezza13 is so I'm not changing the barrels as often. If I can split the line between two or three barrels it will take much longer to run low, especially useful if I'm doing multiple houses instead of returning to the van.

 

think I prefer you right hose reel @spruce haha cheaper too. As for the unit it does have a strainer on the intake end mate, it states it in the description too and can be seen on one of the images. I know I'd see that as a negative myself too although a well positioned bit of gauze and a bulldog clip would sort that little issue out.

 

what do make of the flow rate? Would it be suitable for 50m or hose or even more say 100m? 

 

Daft Q perhaps but I can still use this with a uni valve? 

Edited by Ana

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Apw1210

If you'd like a static van mounted pump box you can build one which is going to be reliable but quality parts are optional 

 

For a box with top of the line components I'd recommend using the following 

 

A large impact resistant storage box with lid " bambox is an affordable brand and well suited for self builds 

 

A 100psi shurflo or flojet water pump

 

Spring digital pump controller 

 

110Ah leisure battery with smart charger and associated plumbing connections and electrical hardware 

 

7.5 amp inline fuse & holder 

Hoselock style hose connectors 

Battery quick connect terminals 

PTFE tape 

Battery bracket or retaining strap 

 

Budget affordable box / trolley compatible system 

 

300x220x120mm electrical enclosure box 

 

12v genetic Ebay 100psi 4lpm water pump 

 

12v PWM digital motor speed controller 

 

12v wireless relay switch 433mhz (optional) 

 

Fuse & fuse holder 

 

Battery isolator switch 

Battery guage / volt meter 

A few lengths of 10mm ID hose 

Various hose fittings, double ear hose clips and hose barbs 

 

Hoselock hose connectors or rectus 21 fitting for water out 

 

12v 12Ah sealed lead acid battery & compatible charger 

 

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Ana

Thanks @Apw1210 I'll look into that and see what I think

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spruce
13 hours ago, Ana said:

Cheers for the thoughts guys.

 

i have considered a diy pump box @Wind o kleen and @Apw1210 and although I'm competent at doing electrics I'd sooner buy in a ready made system for windows, it's just a personal choice really. However, if you guys want to link me to the bits and bobs I'd need to make one I can at least price it up and perhaps have a bash, really don't know what I'd need?

 

the idea behind splitting the hose @wezza13 is so I'm not changing the barrels as often. If I can split the line between two or three barrels it will take much longer to run low, especially useful if I'm doing multiple houses instead of returning to the van.

 

think I prefer you right hose reel @spruce haha cheaper too. As for the unit it does have a strainer on the intake end mate, it states it in the description too and can be seen on one of the images. I know I'd see that as a negative myself too although a well positioned bit of gauze and a bulldog clip would sort that little issue out.

 

what do make of the flow rate? Would it be suitable for 50m or hose or even more say 100m? 

 

Daft Q perhaps but I can still use this with a uni valve? 

 

Sorry, I just looked at the photo and didn't see a strainer. It must be an inline one out of the photo shot.

 

This company does sell wfp equipment. I have seen them advertise a lot but I haven't bought anything from them. I would think its best to send them an email and ask them if its suitable for a 100m length of hose or not. I would be pretty certain that the pump will have a pressure switch so you can use a Univalve. But again adding this query to the email will make 100% sure.

 

For me the negative is the size of the battery and the size of the pump its powering. Now I don't know what amps the pump draws but I see it has a 6amp inline fuse.This indicates that the current draw will be a little less than this.

Now, if the battery supplied is a lead acid battery then they should only be discharged to 50% of capacity if you want them to last. You can discharge them to 80% but every time you do you 'kill' them and dramatically reduce their longevity.

If the pump draws 3 amps (conservative guess) then you don't have much scope for working. 17 amps - 50% = 8.5 amps ÷ 3 amps per hour = 3 hours. We have always believed that on our compact work we spend about 50% of our day actually washing and rinsing the windows. (On commercial we estimate that washing time is more like 80%.) So at best you have enough power for 6 hours of work.

 

I obviously don't know your situation, but for me/us that just wouldn't be good enough. Yes it would be lighter and much easier to take indoors to charge the battery, but I would still opt to spend more and get a decent system with a better controller that will do me a full days work. But that's me.

 

 

 

 

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wezza13

With regards to the pumpbox setup (that you've linked on eBay), it usually lasts a full two days at 8 hours (give or take 15 mins) per day but I charge them every evening. That's two of us using these setups. 

 

And, yes, I use a Univalve with this exact setup and have had no problem with it 👍

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Ana

I appreciate the thoughts @spruce and for your situation it might not cut the mustard, for me I work about six hours a day total so I'd likely be in the same boat as @wezza13 on this one.

 

Id of course ask the relervent questions concerning the valve (although Wezza has no issue) and the length of hose you could use with it as well. Never brought anything off them either but I've found the hose reel on eBay you linked me into so that's sorted when I go down that route.

 

another Q for you wezza, what length hose do you use yours with mate, any idea? 

 

An idea I had today while cleaning was just connecting the back pack to a hose reel and going hoseless, that would also work as I'd leave the pack in the van whenever possible but can be taken out at will if needed. Only downside as I see it is its water capacity but at least I'd be lugging water from one side of the van to another and not up and down the road like I do right now.

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wezza13
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Ana said:

 

another Q for you wezza, what length hose do you use yours with mate, any idea? 

 

 

I use about 90m of Gardiner yellow PVC 8mm hose. 3 x 30m lengths, no problems with it. I use this much as I work on big rural properties, so can run it from the van, all the way around the house, with plenty to spare.

 

Shame you're so far up the country or you would've been welcome to test it out.

Edited by wezza13

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kevinc250

ooohhh this topic brings back so many memories, in the early days we had three vans on the road and I had one of those pump boxes in an old smiley transit and the barrels were mango chutney barrels secured in a rack in the back, ok, different times as it was 13 years ago and we were just starting out and all that, that pump box worked to a tee and it is one of the only items I have left from those early days, I even had a trolley made to suit that box which if i'm honest would be better than whats on offer now.

the strainer on the box would be better if you combined it into a tube so you have the strainer right at the bottom of the barrel,

heres a link for you,

http://www.johnhewitt.com/batteries.htm

this guy is the one to speak to as john keeps all the spares for these, (please be respectfull if you speak to john as, although he is a window cleaner himself he has no tolerance for people whinging and whining nowadays) the one known fault on these are the flow **** so, get it to the flow you like and the add an on/off switch to turn it on and off and you'll be fine.

brilliant bit of kit

 

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wezza13
38 minutes ago, kevinc250 said:

 

http://www.johnhewitt.com/batteries.htm

this guy is the one to speak to as john keeps all the spares for these, (please be respectfull if you speak to john as, although he is a window cleaner himself he has no tolerance for people whinging and whining nowadays) the one known fault on these are the flow **** so, get it to the flow you like and the add an on/off switch to turn it on and off and you'll be fine.

brilliant bit of kit

 

 

I agree, I've spoken to John and he's a nice bloke willing to help out.

 

Had to order a couple of wiring assemblies in the past, highly recommend.

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Apw1210

@wezza13 before i purchased my 210L tank i had a split hose water pick up 

 

One length of hose then quad tee'd using John guest T's with four pick ups and foot valve filters. 

 

It saves changing a barrel every 5 minutes 

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Ana

Still think I'd split the intake line like you @Apw1210 will save extra time switching the barrels around. My frames can hold 12 barrels per time, so drawing water from three per time will likely keep me in flow for a good deal of time.

 

would need to make a filter on each end tho but easy enough 

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