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Religion does seem a bit of a comfort blanket. What rankles is when people insist it's all 'true' 'the only way' etc. based on a book that was wirtten after the events, thousands of years ago. It's no truer than believing in fairies cause someone wrote about them once upon a time. It might be true. It might not. There's no way of ultimately proving either, it's just less likely that not

Information gets corrupted after just a few copies, let alone all this time and people and politics getting in the mix.

Be good if a JW could come on and correct this, but I was once told by a guy very into it and not a junior in their organisation, that only a certain number of followers (20,000?) get into the afterlife realm where they live with lions and other animals (vegetarian lions?) That's not much incentive to new comers?

Like, if I want to get in, do I have to be 'better' than you? And just by wanting to be better to get something and deprive you of eternal happiness doesn't that make me 'worse'?

Also, I asked another 'deeply religious' person, 'what's if I'm really good as a person, but I just don't happen to have heard of or been exposed to your religion, can I get into heaven?' 'No' was the answer. That kind of sums up religion, not spirituality, it's a club, with a status, usually a patriarch, dues to pay, sacrifices to make on the promise of afterlife unprovable reward.

 
I suppose it's a bit like in 2000 years time, no one can 'prove' hitler existed, we will rely on stories and literature, books etc, same as Jesus...
We can't prove he didn't exist either? Just like we can't prove a lot of things in life...

All I'm saying diwrnach, is that sometimes an open mind isn't a bad thing, I can see you strongly disagree with religion, it's very very clear, but I sometimes wonder why your so hostile towards it,

It's remarkable that the bible has survived for 2000 years, no other book has sold more, no other book has been so well preserved, it's quite amazing.

I'm not an expert, and I'm not into history, so I'm chiming out of that now, i have no need to argue about it...
That's the thing Jake we CAN rely on historical records to prove a great many things, things in fact much older than Jesus, but that right there is the entire point, there are no reliable historical records for Jesus, none, the first accounts of his life were written HUNDREDS of years after his supposed death, the first bible was hundreds of years later.

There is not ONE single reliable piece of real historical evidence he existed, not one, I have searched for it myself for several years, to believe in something without any form of evidence whatsoever is insane.

 
Oh and don't pull the "you can't prove he didn't exist" card, that is just silly, the burdon of proof is on the person making the assertion, if I told you there was a big green dragon behind the moon it would be up to me to prove myself right, not up to you to prove me wrong.

 
My experience started with a prayer (an Invitation) and resulted in a physical encounter which changed my life. Reading the book came after.
I just read your page, in your own words "At the time I was taking anti-depressant tablets, which caused me to have irregular heart rhythms. This was worsened by caffeine and sugar. I was also suffering from insomnia"

Then while having not slept for a long time you had a vision of Jesus after asking to see him, now I will openly admit now to when younger taking a lot of drugs and not sleeping for long periods of time, I have seen, heard and been touched by much more impressive things than jesus, this my friend was your own mind, you were having a trip.

 
God bless you all, nite nite /emoticons/smile.png.
You'll probably awake to a 50 page debate in the morning,

Right now it's early in the day here in uk, so this thread will go ballistic in the next 12 hours :rofl:

 
Look up DMT, its responsible for all these life after death experiences and is in large amounts in our brains, please look it up and don't assume to know what it is.

 
If you all set up a direct debit into my account I promise that when you die you will float off to a magical wonderland where you will live forever, if you like I will also turn that old crippled body and mind into a young, healthy one...could you all hurry up and do it sooner rather than later, I've got a pig of a first clean lined up next week that I'd rather not do.

 
I just read your page, in your own words "At the time I was taking anti-depressant tablets, which caused me to have irregular heart rhythms. This was worsened by caffeine and sugar. I was also suffering from insomnia"
Then while having not slept for a long time you had a vision of Jesus after asking to see him, now I will openly admit now to when younger taking a lot of drugs and not sleeping for long periods of time, I have seen, heard and been touched by much more impressive things than jesus, this my friend was your own mind, you were having a trip.
You don't see things when drinking coffee on anti depressants :rofl:

Give it a rest D, we know how you feel...

 
You don't see things when drinking coffee on anti depressants :rofl:
Give it a rest D, we know how you feel...
I can tell you right now from experience, if you want the very best hallucinations don't sleep for awhile.

 
You can't prove he didn't have a real encounter either,

It's changed his life, so it was clearly a very real encounter, think of the millions of people doing drugs that see things, it always makes them more paranoid and more messed up, never better, he's now off anti depressants and sleeping well, so it's contrary to the norm, (I know this first hand having lived with a heroin addict for 2 years, hallucinations don't change people's lives for the better, they make it worse, they certainly don't bring piece and then good nights sleep)

Back to work now, rains stopping.

 
You have to look at these things critically mate.

He was speaking to Christians while on anti depressants and not sleeping while also having heart problems, not a good state to be in, the Christians filled his head with loving Jesus will save you stories, he then, while in a very bad way prays to see him and get help from him, low and behold he does.

We have two possible explanations here, the first is it really was Jesus who took time out of giving children bone cancer to come and give him help, over all the starving children he came and touched his arm and helped him (just out of interest here as this would be very interesting, can you tell me when he came to you, and be honest here, was he a white guy with blonde hair and blue eyes?).

Or we have an, actually he was heavily medicated and lacking sleep and hallucinated it.

The fact that this hallucination had a positive impact really isn't relevant, I had loads of good hallucinations, but I always knew that is what they were.

 
Did you know the oldest bible in existence doesn't even mention Jesus? how odd is that?
Also about that Kind james bible that a large amount of Christians follow, here is an original found where they have gone through it and told them where to re write and change it http://www.addictinginfo.org/2015/10/28/handwritten-draft-of-king-james-bible-discovered-reveals-no-divine-powers/
That is the oldest version of the King James version. Not of the Holy Scriptures that the bible is from.

Original Text comes from the Holy lands. The Dead sea Sea scrolls date back to around 500 years before Christ (old Testament).

There is so much to debate about here that it is not worth getting into in text. I respect your beliefs, or none beliefs /emoticons/biggrin.png.

But... If I put a cup in front of you and told you that the cup wasn't made. it formed itself naturally through nature, you would think I was mad. A simple cup... Yet look around you at everything that is on this Earth, and space, the planets solar system and beyond all working in perfect sync, and you think that it all formed itself through time. Doesn't it make sense that there has to be a Creator??

Jesus lineage is named in full in Mathew 1:1-16 every male name going back to Abraham.

Abraham's lineage is named in full in Genesis.

This wont mean anything to you though if you think it's just a big Fairy tale /emoticons/biggrin.png

 
You mean the same Abraham that heard voices telling him to kill his own children? we have a name for that now and we lock people up in padded cells for it.

So your argument for a creator is that everything must have a creator?

Who created the creator? who created the creator of the creator?

 
The bible says that when jesus returns all the stars in the sky will fall to earth, to even consider writing that, let alone writing it tells me one thing, the person who wrote it had absolutely NO IDEA what the hell they were talking about, how can all those suns that are all massively large then our planet fall onto it?

Its all stories to help people explain things, why is there thunder, God did it, why are we here, God did it etc etc, we have gone a little bit past that now.

 
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