Burned by customer . . . What would you do?

[Dodotop]

Just a quick word of thanks again to all you regular contributors here, I dont post much but have gleaned a lot from reading your guys experiences.

So got burned today by a customer. Think they had been unreliable in the past, so when they rejoined round a few years back I made sure that they were aware of all our T&Cs.
The numbers arent too important but for context its a three monthly job that we do in and out for £133+Vat £160. I always send out notifications weekend before due with date to expect us.
Last visit I surprised the wife as her husband hadnt passed on the message, same thing today. So we have a little chuckle about how hopeless he is and I mention that I can take her number as well to include her in future. She had to go out so was unsure about leaving us alone to do inside, her husband has often done so before but she seemed a bit nervy as I had my lad with me today. I didnt push.

She went away called husband and upon return she said outside only, I said we require 24hr notice when canceling or adjusting, but I wasnt strong, it was very measured and she seemed to understand and said I can message husband. We start front and do a few windows when I get a call from the husband, he says: "Its not going to work out, we are going to have to part ways", I was shocked and again meekly mention our cancelation policy, to which he says "well its my policy for you to give two weeks notice . . .".

Im not very good with confrontations and just kept silent as could feel myself getting mad and didnt think that was gonna help anything. So he hung up on me. We managed to last minute slot in a £65+Vat job from our waiting list, but still a bit out of pocket.

Im just so shocked by the sense of entitlement and lack of respect for you and your business that some people have. I console myself by the fact that for every bad egg theres likely 50/60 great customers out there. Its odd as our relationship for the past 3 or 4 years had been good, and the reasons for bumping them in the past werent this bad.

How would you proceed? We have a 50% late cancelation fee, should I send a bill followed by small claims notices? As always its about the principle as opposed to the money.
Does your reputation in the community effect your view of doing so? If your kids went same school or something like that?!
Ive never had to pursue this with any residential jobs, just on commercial one.

Thanks in advance for all the tips and thoughts.

 

[Part Timer]

Firstly, I very much doubt he has sent you a contract saying 2 weeks notice so he hasn't a leg to stand on there. As you haven't really done any work then if you want to push your terms and conditions then that is your choice. He could say okay then come back, do the work and I'll pay you, something Arbitration might accept, then muck you about for that payment.
I, personally, would shrug my shoulders and walk away as life is hard enough as it is. Surprised being VAT registered you haven't come across more ends though.

 

[Bell Pallisey]

i try to get 1 or 2 revenges each year to stop me getting bitter ,a potato rammed up an exhaust pipe

 

[Scrubsy]

@Josh Lucas must be a whopper job if it's that kind of money. I can imagine your frustration but I wouldn't know the first thing about terms and conditions and how enforceable they are. I can understand the lady being a bit wary of leaving people in her house even if she knows you. She may have been a bit panicky when she rang her husband, and then that's made him like he's trying to save face a bit. Personally I would delete them off your books and not go back. You might find a small claims backfires if the badmouth you, but you'll know best.

 

[Pjj]

I think it’s a walk away job don’t want customers like that , you can’t just go straight to small claims court these days either it’s mediation first then if that fails then court it’s not worth the time and hassle just move on and learn from the experience, I agree it’s galling though .

 

[Bart90]

Just a quick word of thanks again to all you regular contributors here, I dont post much but have gleaned a lot from reading your guys experiences.

So got burned today by a customer. Think they had been unreliable in the past, so when they rejoined round a few years back I made sure that they were aware of all our T&Cs.
The numbers arent too important but for context its a three monthly job that we do in and out for £133+Vat £160. I always send out notifications weekend before due with date to expect us.
Last visit I surprised the wife as her husband hadnt passed on the message, same thing today. So we have a little chuckle about how hopeless he is and I mention that I can take her number as well to include her in future. She had to go out so was unsure about leaving us alone to do inside, her husband has often done so before but she seemed a bit nervy as I had my lad with me today. I didnt push.

She went away called husband and upon return she said outside only, I said we require 24hr notice when canceling or adjusting, but I wasnt strong, it was very measured and she seemed to understand and said I can message husband. We start front and do a few windows when I get a call from the husband, he says: "Its not going to work out, we are going to have to part ways", I was shocked and again meekly mention our cancelation policy, to which he says "well its my policy for you to give two weeks notice . . .".

Im not very good with confrontations and just kept silent as could feel myself getting mad and didnt think that was gonna help anything. So he hung up on me. We managed to last minute slot in a £65+Vat job from our waiting list, but still a bit out of pocket.

Im just so shocked by the sense of entitlement and lack of respect for you and your business that some people have. I console myself by the fact that for every bad egg theres likely 50/60 great customers out there. Its odd as our relationship for the past 3 or 4 years had been good, and the reasons for bumping them in the past werent this bad.

How would you proceed? We have a 50% late cancelation fee, should I send a bill followed by small claims notices? As always its about the principle as opposed to the money.
Does your reputation in the community effect your view of doing so? If your kids went same school or something like that?!
Ive never had to pursue this with any residential jobs, just on commercial one.

Thanks in advance for all the tips and thoughts.

It's business, it happens. Drop the job, shrug your shoulders and move on. Then give yourself a pat on the back that you have a business turning over 90k+. No mean feat.

 

[Deleted member 7446]

Just a quick word of thanks again to all you regular contributors here, I dont post much but have gleaned a lot from reading your guys experiences.

So got burned today by a customer. Think they had been unreliable in the past, so when they rejoined round a few years back I made sure that they were aware of all our T&Cs.
The numbers arent too important but for context its a three monthly job that we do in and out for £133+Vat £160. I always send out notifications weekend before due with date to expect us.
Last visit I surprised the wife as her husband hadnt passed on the message, same thing today. So we have a little chuckle about how hopeless he is and I mention that I can take her number as well to include her in future. She had to go out so was unsure about leaving us alone to do inside, her husband has often done so before but she seemed a bit nervy as I had my lad with me today. I didnt push.

She went away called husband and upon return she said outside only, I said we require 24hr notice when canceling or adjusting, but I wasnt strong, it was very measured and she seemed to understand and said I can message husband. We start front and do a few windows when I get a call from the husband, he says: "Its not going to work out, we are going to have to part ways", I was shocked and again meekly mention our cancelation policy, to which he says "well its my policy for you to give two weeks notice . . .".

Im not very good with confrontations and just kept silent as could feel myself getting mad and didnt think that was gonna help anything. So he hung up on me. We managed to last minute slot in a £65+Vat job from our waiting list, but still a bit out of pocket.

Im just so shocked by the sense of entitlement and lack of respect for you and your business that some people have. I console myself by the fact that for every bad egg theres likely 50/60 great customers out there. Its odd as our relationship for the past 3 or 4 years had been good, and the reasons for bumping them in the past werent this bad.

How would you proceed? We have a 50% late cancelation fee, should I send a bill followed by small claims notices? As always its about the principle as opposed to the money.
Does your reputation in the community effect your view of doing so? If your kids went same school or something like that?!
Ive never had to pursue this with any residential jobs, just on commercial one.

Thanks in advance for all the tips and thoughts.

Customers that mess you around are not worth keeping on your rounds. Wave goodbye to them

 

[WindyinNorfolk]

I first glance I thought they had dowsed you it petrol and set it alight!

I will be totally brutal here - your T&C mean diddly squat. you say your boy was with you - is he part of the biz or just along for the ride ? - 2 men would be quite alarming for some people alone in there house ( for starters you don't know her history ) - and I wouldn't clean any internal without the owner present - you leave yourself wide open for accusations of any kind.

Best to put it down to experience - forget it and move on

 

[RWCleaning]

Sorry to hear it.
I’d be annoyed, I’d send a professional text, to show that I am annoyed and to ask for say x amount of the clean (but I wouldn’t expect them to pay) then that would be it for me.
Theres not much of a lesson to learn really, if someone difficult wants to cancel a clean at the last minute and there’s no official contract to stop them doing so, then rarely from time to time it will happen.
But thankfully that’s very rare.

If you are pally with window cleaners in your area, I’d give them an heads up and tell them not to bother if they get asked to quote. At least it makes it more difficult for them to find someone else perhaps.

 

[Dodotop]

Thanks for all the feedback. I think just needed to let off steam and mainly was frustrated at myself for not finding the words when the custy called.

@WindyinNorfolk - yes it was a very clickbait title! Just to clarify the customer is the one who brought up leaving us to do insides and was only a subject of convo as they had done so before. I’m very surprised when people have that level of trust, I for sure wouldn’t for tradesmen at ours, but for ones that we have a good relationship with I do, id never thought about exposing ourselves to accusations though so something to keep in mind. I was with my lad who’s been working with me two days a week since he left school last summer.

I’m curious, do you not have cancellation policy in your T&Cs? I thought that’s pretty standard. If not how do you protect your days earnings?

 

[Alan James]

I would at least give them some grief. Email them threatning to small claim them. Ecplaun how they have lost you earnings etc.Send a few. Upset them like they have upset you. Threaten to put them on a tradesmans list of bad payers. Something I picked up on years ago from this forum I think.. I find it works in most cases and I promise you will feel better.
Cheeky bastxxxs.
Regards all.
Alan.

 

[Cleanco]

Unless you’ve got a written contract that’s been signed by the customer there’s not much you can do. When customer relations have broken down like that it’s best just to suck it up and move on.

 

[Pjj]

Unless you’ve got a written contract that’s been signed by the customer there’s not much you can do. When customer relations have broken down like that it’s best just to suck it up and move on.

As window cleaners we have a verbal agreement with the customer that’s just as legally binding as a written contract , but it’s not worth trying to enforce if for the price of an average domestic clean It’s far better to just dump and move on .

 

[Jaygti]

Don’t waste any more time, you won’t get any money from them now whatever your terms and conditions are.
So dump , move on and forget

 

[ched999uk]

I would at least give them some grief. Email them threatning to small claim them. Ecplaun how they have lost you earnings etc.Send a few. Upset them like they have upset you. Threaten to put them on a tradesmans list of bad payers. Something I picked up on years ago from this forum I think.. I find it works in most cases and I promise you will feel better.
Cheeky bastxxxs.
Regards all.
Alan.

Just be aware that to get to the small claims court they will try to offer arbitration (Free at the moment) but both parties have to agree, if not then small claims.
Due to the Data Protection Act you can't legally pass any personal customer info on to 3rd parties without their permission - so no tradesman's list of bad payers are allowed!

 

[Pjj]

Just be aware that to get to the small claims court they will try to offer arbitration (Free at the moment) but both parties have to agree, if not then small claims.
Due to the Data Protection Act you can't legally pass any personal customer info on to 3rd parties without their permission - so no tradesman's list of bad payers are allowed!

There are still photos of people who are banned from pubs in our town on a pub watch openly displayed on the doors I would have thought that was in breach of data protection? But still nothing wrong with verbally telling other cleaners about bad players etc there are several of us that do that down here , one woman in particular can’t get a cleaner at all and is very frustrated she has tried all several times and no one will take the job on she has no idea why

 

[Bell Pallisey]

There are still photos of people who are banned from pubs in our town on a pub watch openly displayed on the doors I would have thought that was in breach of data protection? But still nothing wrong with verbally telling other cleaners about bad players etc there are several of us that do that down here , one woman in particular can’t get a cleaner at all and is very frustrated she has tried all several times and no one will take the job on she has no idea why

thats a great idea,bad player list . years back i was talking to a local kitchen fitter he was telling me that [on the big jobs] a nearby solicitor kept a "bible" of bad payers/courtcase queens etc , you had to pay a fee for him to check your potential client out ,but worth it when the job can run into tens of thousands

 

[vinchenzo19]

Obviously your round / business is a pretty big one mate but personally I would have just done the outside for half the money. Saves grief and you may have kept the customer that way.
Again, you’ve got a good size business there so your terms etc and running must be working for you

 

[Alan James]

Just to clarify.
There is no such thing as a bad payers list for tradesman.
But they do not know that do they.
Obviously do not spend too much time with this, but give them some grief. I actually speak on the doorstep and explain why they should pay me. I tell them that they would not do it to a plumber or an electrician for example, so why do they think they can do it to me. I explain at time of quote terms etc.
Alan.

 

[P4dstar]

I really want the OP to take the customer to small claims. Mainly because I like a bit of drama and I’d like to see how that pans out.

 

[WindyinNorfolk]

Small claims court - your having a laugh!
As pointed out it goes to mediation first - the only hassle will be of your own creation

Simple defence for them the wife felt intimidated alone in her property with 2 men trying to force a service upon her (truth or no - you'd be nuts to pursue that and get this in social media or the papers)

OP - No cancellation policy here not worth the time and effort of something you cant enforce - on our side customers that cancel couple of times in a row or become problematic are removed from the schedule

Bad debts and debtors list are a long way from the situation here, work was not carried out they don't owe anything
(try to be paid for your time in court - they will laugh at you - proper claim for materials brought specifically for a job is different - your time - not a chance)