Cleaning upvc best way

[Diamond geezer]

Hello again everyone. ive read the posts on this,Virosol,ubick ect and one about prefering thease to having hypo driping down on you,but its the hypo iam interested in.Ive never ever used it,i know its dangerous and its used in soft washing,having watched vidios Do you mix your own? Ive talked to someone about the Ioncs contact cleaner system he owns,he says its the best stuff  and i would think he,s tried everything.The sprayer is about 600 quid though.He tells me the cleaner will work from a back pack ,but it wont foam.Can any one sell me a small canister of this please as id like to try it, and dont want to buy all 4 canisters they sell minimum, in case i cant get on with it 

I have a house,always get spoting,i Know the procedure,frames first windows after,but its still a pain,would like to clean the frames so clean that they dont cause spotting,and iam wondering if a hypo mix will do the trick.Whats the hypo doing when it works please?( mad scientists only need to reply) This house ive mentoned is mid way between old upvc and modern upvc.Ive found the old has about 1/4" rubber on the glass,modern virtualy none and cleans up a real treat as aposed to old which can give problems.ive been doing wfp a couple of years though, and have i cleaned  old frames that  well that they dont spot any more,or am i imagining it? Cheers

 

[Pjj]

Hypo cleaning windows and frames won’t lrevent spotting that’s diwn it bad cleaning techniques .

Hypo will bring older plastics up well we use it a lot but you di need to be careful otherwise you will turn white plastic yellow ,it will return to white after 2-3 hours . The problem with using hypo on gfs is that you will get run off on walls and drips in paths that will leave clean marks behind . The ionics contact foam is hypo based ,it won’t work any better than normal hypo for £12 for 20 ltr there sprayer is way over priced .

 

[Diamond geezer]

How do you prepair your hypo please PJ

 

[Pjj]

How do you prepair your hypo please PJ

300-500 ml of surfactant in a neat drum of hypo then 1 ltr of hypo to 5 or 6 ltr  of water, if a weaker mix is needed 1 ltr of hypo to 7 or 8 ltr of water if doing plastics the surfactant isn’t needed really.

 

[Diamond geezer]

How big is the drum of hypo,does the shelf life deminish when the surfactant is added,in other words,can i just make up smaller amounts when needed,will the drum keep its strenth longer if the surfactant isnt added  to the whole drum.surfactant,fairy liquid any good?Somebody sugested wall paper paste what do you think of that.sorry for all the Questions,Newbies who needs em  eh,but thanks very much

 

[Pjj]

How big is the drum of hypo,does the shelf life deminish when the surfactant is added,in other words,can i just make up smaller amounts when needed,will the drum keep its strenth longer if the surfactant isnt added  to the whole drum.surfactant,fairy liquid any good?Somebody sugested wall paper paste what do you think of that.sorry for all the Questions,Newbies who needs em  eh,but thanks very much

Once opened a drum of hypo gradually looses its strength the shelf life is around 6 months but I have regularly used 3 month out of date stuff with no ill effects , adding surfactant doesn’t alter the shelf life . Most commercials available drums of hypo are 20 or 25 ltr , yes you could decant some and mix smaller amounts I would say a normal 3 bed semi UPVC would require approximately 5-10 ltr of mix  . Don’t  put fairy liquid in hypo it’s illegal and can be carcinogenic ,also it doesn’t mix in it will sit in the bottom of the drum and go like a gell blocking the filter and pump . It is illegal tk add anything to hypo that isn’t specifically designed to be added . If you buy the   Laurel stuff in my picture I posted it’s cheap as chips and works as good as any other surfactant , the clever wash is good but dearer costs £40 fir 5 ltr but you only need 300-500 ml to a neat drum of hypo so goes a long way , don’t try and cut corners hypo and the surfactant is very cheap on an avarage £350-500 job material costs are around £30-45 maximum 

 

[Diamond geezer]

Thnks PJ

 

[Diamond geezer]

The more expensive surfactant,is the nice smelley one i think i saw in another post.,could you tell me of a suplier near me please?If  i wanted to soft wash a driveway how strong could i use it? Thanks for all your info.no fairy liquid.!

 

[Pjj]

The more expensive surfactant,is the nice smelley one i think i saw in another post.,could you tell me of a suplier near me please?If  i wanted to soft wash a driveway how strong could i use it? Thanks for all your info.no fairy liquid.!

I get mine from Bonnymans , for drives cement based , brick block and resin bound  a 4-1 mix is better you don’t need surfactant for that as it’s a flat surface but again if it’s in the drum it doesn’t matter , cleverwash dies have a scent mask but it’s not enough to do away with the smell of bleach . 

 

[Cleanco]

Once opened a drum of hypo gradually looses its strength the shelf life is around 6 months but I have regularly used 3 month out of date stuff with no ill effects , adding surfactant doesn’t alter the shelf life . Most commercials available drums of hypo are 20 or 25 ltr , yes you could decant some and mix smaller amounts I would say a normal 3 bed semi UPVC would require approximately 5-10 ltr of mix  . Don’t  put fairy liquid in hypo it’s illegal and can be carcinogenic ,also it doesn’t mix in it will sit in the bottom of the drum and go like a gell blocking the filter and pump . It is illegal tk add anything to hypo that isn’t specifically designed to be added . If you buy the   Laurel stuff in my picture I posted it’s cheap as chips and works as good as any other surfactant , the clever wash is good but dearer costs £40 fir 5 ltr but you only need 300-500 ml to a neat drum of hypo so goes a long way , don’t try and cut corners hypo and the surfactant is very cheap on an avarage £350-500 job material costs are around £30-45 maximum 

Is there a shelf life if unopened?

 

[Pjj]

Is there a shelf life if unopened?

If you look on the drum there should be a use by date , the dairy hypochlorite we use has a 6 month shelf life I don’t know if this is beacause farmers have to sterilise milking parlours and equipment with it or not , but I have regularly used opened drums in -2 that are 3 months out of date for soft washing without a problem   

 

[Diamond geezer]

Hi PJ Ive just been writeing down this info in my note book incase i loose this post.You have said,"you dont need surfactant really for plastics or flat drives etc" yet you put it in a neat drum of hypo to start with,hope you dont mind me asking,but do you do a lot of soft washing walls then?

 

[Pjj]

Hi PJ Ive just been writeing down this info in my note book incase i loose this post.You have said,"you dont need surfactant really for plastics or flat drives etc" yet you put it in a neat drum of hypo to start with,hope you dont mind me asking,but do you do a lot of soft washing walls then?

Surfactant is designed to help the hypo cling to vertical surfaces so drives and roofs don’t really need it so if needing to save money don’t put it in the mix for  jobs like that , we put 300-500 ml in each neat drum of hypo for walls and yes we softwash a couple of hundred houses a year , we don't do many roofs  as that’s not a common thing that’s done down hear , any questions just ask , happy to help if I can 

 

[Diamond geezer]

Thanks very much

 

[Diamond geezer]

How strong is the hypo you use please? I think its about 14% isnt it?So if i dilute 1ltr hypo to 5 or  6 ltr water it must be very weak. If i dilute 1ltr of hypo with one ltr water,its potencey drops by 50% to 7 add another ltr of water to that = 3 1/2% and so on 5&6 ltrs i might as well use ice cream.Where have i gone wrong please?

 

[Pjj]

How strong is the hypo you use please? I think its about 14% isnt it?So if i dilute 1ltr hypo to 5 or  6 ltr water it must be very weak. If i dilute 1ltr of hypo with one ltr water,its potencey drops by 50% to 7 add another ltr of water to that = 3 1/2% and so on 5&6 ltrs i might as well use ice cream.Where have i gone wrong please?

We use 10% strength hypo and dilute it 4-1 for walls and 5/6 to one for plastics, works fine  a 2% strength mix is ok for most things , ime sure  the tech gurus will be able to explain mixing ratios better than me Dave and Kevin are your ones for that . 

 

[Dave B]

Once opened a drum of hypo gradually looses its strength the shelf life is around 6 months but I have regularly used 3 month out of date stuff with no ill effects , adding surfactant doesn’t alter the shelf life . Most commercials available drums of hypo are 20 or 25 ltr , yes you could decant some and mix smaller amounts I would say a normal 3 bed semi UPVC would require approximately 5-10 ltr of mix  . Don’t  put fairy liquid in hypo it’s illegal and can be carcinogenic ,also it doesn’t mix in it will sit in the bottom of the drum and go like a gell blocking the filter and pump . It is illegal tk add anything to hypo that isn’t specifically designed to be added . If you buy the   Laurel stuff in my picture I posted it’s cheap as chips and works as good as any other surfactant , the clever wash is good but dearer costs £40 fir 5 ltr but you only need 300-500 ml to a neat drum of hypo so goes a long way , don’t try and cut corners hypo and the surfactant is very cheap on an avarage £350-500 job material costs are around £30-45 maximum 

technically the sodium laureth sulphate you are talking about should be illegal as the chemicals in it will react with hypo and cause some chlorine gas.

I use it but in reality you really shouldn't. 

On fascias and dirty first cleans I'll buy a 50p bottle of bleach which is the equivalent to 4.6% hypo usually with some hydroxide added.

Mix a bottle of that in a 25l drum of pure and you won't stain anything but it will come up spotless.

 

[Dave B]

We use 10% strength hypo and dilute it 4-1 for walls and 5/6 to one for plastics, works fine  a 2% strength mix is ok for most things , ime sure  the tech gurus will be able to explain mixing ratios better than me Dave and Kevin are your ones for that . 

If you use a 25l drum and want a 2% mix which I wouldn't go stronger than on upvc you need 3.5714 L hypo (3.5l) and top the whole drum up with water (tap water is better as the ph value suits the hypo more than pure).

I wouldn't go stronger than that for plastic.

For patios etc you ideally want a 4% mix so double the hypo (7l).

I round it down as that is for 14% hypo but when you buy it it states 14-15%.

@Pjjdoes a hell of a lot more of this than me but I am good at chemistry lol.

 

[ched999uk]

How strong is the hypo you use please? I think its about 14% isnt it?So if i dilute 1ltr hypo to 5 or  6 ltr water it must be very weak. If i dilute 1ltr of hypo with one ltr water,its potencey drops by 50% to 7 add another ltr of water to that = 3 1/2% and so on 5&6 ltrs i might as well use ice cream.Where have i gone wrong please?

I'm not sure your calcs are correct.

If you have 1 litre of 14% hypo and add 1 litres of pure the hypo concentration is 7% = total liquid 2 liters

Again if you have 1 liter of 14% hypo and add 2 litres of pure the hypo concentration is 4.6% = total liquid 3 liters

So in your example 1 liter 14% hypo and add 5 liters of pure the hypo concentration is 2.3% = total liquid 6 liters

The formula is:

C1V1 = C2V2
C1 = is the concentration of the stock solution. (Starting Hypo % )
V1 = is the volume of the concentrated stock solution. (eg 1 liter of hypo)
C2 = is the final concentration of the diluted solution (final % of hypo mix you want)
V2 = is the final volume of the diluted solution. (ie volume of hypo + volume of pure)

So if you know C1(starting Hypo %), V1(say use 1 liter of hypo), and C2 (the % Hypo mix you want) you can calculate V2

Say you want 4.6% hypo mix:
eg (C1xV1)/C2 = V2
eg (14x1)/4.6 = 3.043 liters in total so - 1 liter of hypo plus 2 liters of pure gives 4.6% hypo mix. NOT 3.5%.

Hope that helps clarify how to mix hypo to get % you want.

 

[Dave B]

I'm not sure your calcs are correct.

If you have 1 litre of 14% hypo and add 1 litres of pure the hypo concentration is 7% = total liquid 2 liters

Again if you have 1 liter of 14% hypo and add 2 litres of pure the hypo concentration is 4.6% = total liquid 3 liters

So in your example 1 liter 14% hypo and add 5 liters of pure the hypo concentration is 2.3% = total liquid 6 liters

The formula is:

C1V1 = C2V2
C1 = is the concentration of the stock solution. (Starting Hypo % )
V1 = is the volume of the concentrated stock solution. (eg 1 liter of hypo)
C2 = is the final concentration of the diluted solution (final % of hypo mix you want)
V2 = is the final volume of the diluted solution. (ie volume of hypo + volume of pure)

So if you know C1(starting Hypo %), V1(say use 1 liter of hypo), and C2 (the % Hypo mix you want) you can calculate V2

Say you want 4.6% hypo mix:
eg (C1xV1)/C2 = V2
eg (14x1)/4.6 = 3.043 liters in total so - 1 liter of hypo plus 2 liters of pure gives 4.6% hypo mix. NOT 3.5%.

Hope that helps clarify how to mix hypo to get % you want.

That would be 985.7ml for 3l of 4.6%

 

[ched999uk]

That would be 985.7ml for 3l of 4.6%

You are correct that 0.9857L of 14% hypo and 2 liters of pure would be 4.6%.

I was just using 1.0L as an example and rounding the 3.043 liters down as it's much easier to measure in liters than a small number of millilitres. 

I'm not  good at measuring 14.3ml or 43ml in the field ? 

To be exact 1L of 14% hypo + 2 of pure = 4.66667% mix