Fitting Waterfed Tank in VW Caddy

[Paul Symonds]

Hi, 

Thank you in advance for any help possible. 

I have recently just upgraded from trolley and traditional window cleaning to a van waterfed system. 

However I am still to fix the system to my van. I am looking for advice of how to do it especially from any one that has fitted one to a VW caddy 2k. 

I don't want to ratchet strap it, I want to secure fix it to the floor/chassis whatever is best, most secure and easiest. 

Any advice and especially photos would be much appreciated. Thanks. 

 

[P4dstar]

I bought a frame for my tank. It is bolted through the floor. A lot of guys use spreader plates to spread the pressure the tank frame puts on the chassis.

This is the frame I have;

https://www.thecleaningwarehouse.co.uk/500l-upright-tank-retaining-frame-2351-p.asp

They're selling the same one cheaper on eBay at last check also.

I also use ratchet straps just to be 100% certain although i'm fairly confident the frame is safe alone. Get yourself a mechanic to drill the holes and bolt it down for you as they're likely to know where is safe to drill and where isn't. 

 

[Jango]

You would be best to ask a mechanic. 

I have a caddy, you need to make sure you don’t drill through the fuel tank. They drop the tank before bolting the frame in. 

 

[Paul Symonds]

Thanks for your replies. I ask my local mechanic and they said they wouldn't like to do it as they don't know where the tank should go, over axles, in middle of etc, or what it would do to the van. Maybe I'll try ask at another garage. 

If anyone else has any good advice, please tell. Thanks. 

 

[P4dstar]

The standard place to position the tank is directly behind the bulk head across the width of the van. There are some who have done other ways but this is the standard way to fit them for most people. Mine was completed by a mobile mechanic, he charged me £40 I believe and supplied the bolts. It isn't the same van but the principal is the same.

I think @spruce recently posted some pictures of spreader plates, can't find the post though?

 

[Paul Symonds]

Thanks @P4dstar. Did your mechanic bolt to the chassis or just to the van floor using spreader plates? 

 

[spruce]

Here's a link to a thread that discussed this.

I'm sure it was what @P4dstar is referring to @Paul Symonds as it contains both the weight distribution formula and a photo of spreader plates another windie used.

https://windowcleaningforums.co.uk/topic/15870-tank-position/#post-279971

Most car derived small vans you can fit the tank close to the bulkhead as the front axle is further forward. If you look through the side loading door you will find the 'centre line' of your tank is much closer to your rear axle than your front axle. (If the centre line of your tank was in the middle of your front and rear axle then each axle will bear half the weight of the tank, its frame and the water inside the tank.)

You can fit any size tank in the back of a van. I could fit 2 x 1000 liter IBC tanks in the back of my van, but I could only fill one with 700 liters and the other with 250 liters before my payload was used up. So your garage was making an excuse for not wanting to do the job. Also, they don't want the responsibility of fitting it which I can understand.

There must be a van conversion business in Southampton. These guys take on van conversions like fitting rear seats, fitting work stations with side out storage, fitting roof racks and towbars. These guys will definitely take a job on like this. You will make it easier for them if you have a little diesel in the tank as possible when they do the job.

The problem with car derived vans is that the fuel tank sits under where rear passenger seat is in the people carrier version.

I have fitted 3 x 500 liters tanks; 2 in PSA vans and 1 in a lwb Transit Connect. The Berlingo/Partner vans work best with the tank fitted width ways as the tank securing bolts through the floor straddle the fuel tank. The Transit Connect was fitted long ways, (son in law wanted it fitted this way so he could use the side space for other jobs he also did) and that straddled the diesel tank as well.

I was able to not drop the diesel tank as I could secure the sides with nutserts into the floor. These weren't load bearing what where there to hold prevent the sides of the tank frame from moving. The tank was removed 4 years later when the van was sold. There was no evidence of movement of the tank in 4 years.

My son's first van was a Peugeot Partner 800 LX. On a couple of occassions I over filled the tank. Because its a car derived van, spilt water filled up the rear passenger seat footwells as well as the front footwells soaking the carpets. That van stunk of wet/damp.

So with his current Berlingo van I fiberglassed the floor and moulded sides like a tube so any overflow could only leave the van via the rear doors. The van has been dry since the tank was fitted. 

 

[spruce]

Thanks @P4dstar. Did your mechanic bolt to the chassis or just to the van floor using spreader plates? 

Car derived vans don't have a chassis as such. They have two box sections that run down the inner length of the van. Their main strength is in the side sills and you can't secure anything to them. You have to be careful about drilling holes in the chassis.

The MOT inspector that I have used for years will fail a van if he sees a hole drilled in a chassis as his interpretation of this is that even one hole will weaken the intergrity of the chassis.

Its not a problem on my current van as I have only spreader plates across the floor.

He is unable to test my new van as its a class 7 van so that has gone to another test station. This MOT tester has no issue with the tank secured through the chassis as long as it also has reasonable size spreader plates with the job done professionally.

So the moral of the story is the make sure that the job done is acceptable to your MOT inspector. This is an area where the inspector has to use his own judgement. Some are more strict than others. (I bought my new van In February last year to replace my current van. It had a full MOT test. The van has been sitting around for a year whilst I mess on with making a tank frame and other mods. The van had done 245 miles last year between MOTs. In 245 miles this new inspector decided that he add an advisory that it needed new brake pads and discs all round. All that van did that last year was drive from Manchester to Teesside via Chesterfield where I collected a second hand factory fitted full steel bulkhead I purchased on my way back.)

Interestly I also spoke to my current inspector about the towbar. I was thinking of fitting rollers through the floor and securing the outer roller (fairlead) to the towbar frame that runs the width of the back. I could weld a bracket onto the towbar but if I drilled 2 holes in it to fit brackets the van would fail its MOT.

 

[P4dstar]

Thanks @P4dstar. Did your mechanic bolt to the chassis or just to the van floor using spreader plates? 

Couldn't tell you mate, I trust him to have done a good job so just left him to it. I told him I would be ratchet strapping it down once he was done incase it changed what he needed to do. Spruce's advice is a lot more comprehensive on this subject, i'd go with him haha.

 

[Robt100]

@Paul Symonds My wife has a VW Caddy 2k with a 500L "flat" tank fitted. I'm trying to remember, but I think the tank and frame are from PureFreedom. Its bolted in using spreader plates through the floor, and positioned about 1 inch off the bulkhead (we also fitted a metal bulkhead, as the idea of the little plastic things in an accident didn't bode well, lost a fellow window cleaner that way in a crash). I think it currently uses 6 large bolts with about 3" square spreaders for each (which are also about 1/2 inch thick).~

I know I have photos somewhere, but I can't find them at the moment, I shall try and get some both inside and under the van. I remember the front bolts are far forward enough that they actually end up being bolted in via the foot-well behind the seats. We've also bolted in the hose reels (little tip, if your putting 2 in the rear, the driver side reel is a nightmare, one of our bolts had to be put in above the exhaust rear box ?)

Apart from the sloshing about a bit from the water, the van handles fine even when full, the tank is pretty much centrally mounted across the length of the van.

 

[Paul Symonds]

Thanks @sprucevery informative.

@Robt100 that would be brilliant if you could get some photos, that would be just what I'm looking for to get me started and heading back in the right direction. Glad someone else has a caddy and has done it. How do you get on with the payload with the 500l, I was wary that might overload me. Thanks. 

 

[Robt100]

@Paul Symonds The payload is very touch-and-go. I think when I worked it out, on a full tank with both reels etc, we can both get in as long as its under 1/2 a tank of fuel ? If you aren't planning on a 2-man business/system it might be worth going down to 400-450L route just to play it safe.

EDIT: Just went out and got some photos Hope these help! One of the thinner washer & bolt in the front of the tank in the footwell, and one of the bolts underneath behind the fuel tank, all spread out at similar intervals, think its 6 or 8 in the back. The other pictures should give a better idea of location from the bulkhead and also space around the tank, like the handy slot on the drivers side for a set of collapse-able step ladders. And finally a shot of the van to show how it looks (albeit with no water loaded in!)

 

[Paul Symonds]

Thanks for the photos @Robt100. How did you get to the underside of the metal van floor, mine seems to have some sort of cover underneath the van?

 

[Robt100]

@Paul Symonds Sorry for the late reply. No cover on mine, you may have to drop the spare wheel out of the way to get a better view but thats about it?