Premature wear on clutch

[Rahul]

Hi All,

I run a 70 plate LWB Vauxhall Vivaro.
I use a 1000lt hot water system mounted in between the axles ( perhaps 1 foot more towards the rear.

My previous van was a Toyota hiace which did 145,000 and needed a clutch changed once.

I’ve had to change the clutch on my Vauxhall at 12,000 miles and it’s now needing a change soon at 22,000 miles.

Am I missing something here? The van is technically rated for the weight and should be able to go 40 - 50,000 miles before needing a clutch change.

Has anyone had similar experiences? I’m considering changing to a single cab Toyota hilux which might be able to cope more with the weight and what’s being asked if it.

 

[Pjj]

Hi All,

I run a 70 plate LWB Vauxhall Vivaro.
I use a 1000lt hot water system mounted in between the axles ( perhaps 1 foot more towards the rear.

My previous van was a Toyota hiace which did 145,000 and needed a clutch changed once.

I’ve had to change the clutch on my Vauxhall at 12,000 miles and it’s now needing a change soon at 22,000 miles.

Am I missing something here? The van is technically rated for the weight and should be able to go 40 - 50,000 miles before needing a clutch change.

Has anyone had similar experiences? I’m considering changing to a single cab Toyota hilux which might be able to cope more with the weight and what’s being asked if it.

I had a Renault master that had a payload of 1640 kg And that needed a clutch after 30,000 miles that was with a 1000, ltr set up . I think it’s the constant stop start , and hill starts that causes premature wear . Got an auto now and hopefully that will last longer .

 

[Cleanco]

My flywheel collapsed on a brand new transit after 25000/3 years. I was a bit pi55ed at the time but apparently it’s a common thing when carrying heavy loads even if under the specified weight limit. Being the heighest weight spec I expected everything to be up rated to cope with the extra weight but it seems not. That said I previously had a transit connect which was always nearly at the weight limit and only had to change the clutch at 60,000 so god knows. I think it’s just pot luck as i absolutely hammered the connect. I reckon they are just using cheaper parts these days to cut costs on production and get you back in the showroom for repairs as quickly as possible.

 

[Rahul]

My flywheel collapsed on a brand new transit after 25000/3 years. I was a bit pi55ed at the time but apparently it’s a common thing when carrying heavy loads even if under the specified weight limit. Being the heighest weight spec I expected everything to be up rated to cope with the extra weight but it seems not. That said I previously had a transit connect which was always nearly at the weight limit and only had to change the clutch at 60,000 so god knows. I think it’s just pot luck as i absolutely hammered the connect. I reckon they are just using cheaper parts these days to cut costs on production and get you back in the showroom for repairs as quickly as possible.

Agreed.

They don’t do any aftermarket parts for the Vivaro but with the hilux there’s loads of suspension and clutch options.

The Peugeot, Citroen and Toyota vans are exactly the same as the Vauxhall so there aren’t many alternatives in my mind. Might have to but the bullet and go with the hilux!

 

[Deleted member 12462]

Guessing the clutch pedal sinks straight down to the bottom when pressed. I had a vivaro and it's the clutch master cylinder it's internal.in the gearbox so when the seal goes it all goes and has to be replaced.i had 3 clutches in 4 years and I put it down to.a bad design and the fact of the weight of the tank.

 

[Cleanco]

Agreed.

They don’t do any aftermarket parts for the Vivaro but with the hilux there’s loads of suspension and clutch options.

The Peugeot, Citroen and Toyota vans are exactly the same as the Vauxhall so there aren’t many alternatives in my mind. Might have to but the bullet and go with the hilux!

It’s all about money pal. We need to find a way of cleaning windiws and them getting dirty again so they want us back sooner and then we will be on the gravy train?
That said I do miss the ease of fortnightly cleans but don’t miss the prices back then?

 

[Part Timer]

I know this is not what you've asked but I'd be more worried that you've overloaded the back axle. With a 1000l tank you'll be carrying over 1200kgs plus driver and passenger.
Personally I'd be going over a weighbridge, they can weigh your front and back axles.
@Master Jedi Alejandro and I both have had our vans over weighbridges and the official stated payload isn't, in our experience, what is published

 

[Pjj]

I know this is not what you've asked but I'd be more worried that you've overloaded the back axle. With a 1000l tank you'll be carrying over 1200kgs plus driver and passenger.
Personally I'd be going over a weighbridge, they can weigh your front and back axles.
@Master Jedi Alejandro and I both have had our vans over weighbridges and the official stated payload isn't, in our experience, what is published

We have a Toyota proace lwb and the payload of that is 1400 kg according to the paperwork and the dealer , we only have a 600 ltr thermopure in it with a load of other kit never put it on a weigbridge might be worth doing so just out of interest.

 

[Part Timer]

We have a Toyota proace lwb and the payload of that is 1400 kg according to the paperwork and the dealer , we only have a 600 ltr thermopure in it with a load of other kit never put it on a weigbridge might be worth doing so just out of interest.

I personally think they don't include the spare wheel, bulkhead and anything else in the vehicle weight as my van with a 1640kg payload is right on the limit with an 800l tank in it. Admittedly the twin stack with 8mm hose will be heavy and I'm a weight liability as well but even with this we should be comfortably under.

 

[Pjj]

I personally think they don't include the spare wheel, bulkhead and anything else in the vehicle weight as my van with a 1640kg payload is right on the limit with an 800l tank in it. Admittedly the twin stack with 8mm hose will be heavy and I'm a weight liability as well but even with this we should be comfortably under.

Not sure about vans but I know when I worked at the garage years ago when a lorry was weight for plating they removed the spare wheel and only had a small amount of fuel in the tanks , sometimes they even put alloy wheels on them got them plated then put the steel ones back on !,

 

[Rahul]

I know this is not what you've asked but I'd be more worried that you've overloaded the back axle. With a 1000l tank you'll be carrying over 1200kgs plus driver and passenger.
Personally I'd be going over a weighbridge, they can weigh your front and back axles.
@Master Jedi Alejandro and I both have had our vans over weighbridges and the official stated payload isn't, in our experience, what is published

Good point.

But as someone else mentioned my van is similar to the pro ace with a 1.4 ton payload capacity.

The Vauxhall dealership can’t seem to explain it either as I asked whether the location of the payload was connected to clutch wear and they said it wasn’t.

Also if the van can tow 2-3 tons it should be capable of carrying 1.4 tons? Or does the weight affect things differently

 

[Part Timer]

Good point.

But as someone else mentioned my van is similar to the pro ace with a 1.4 ton payload capacity.

The Vauxhall dealership can’t seem to explain it either as I asked whether the location of the payload was connected to clutch wear and they said it wasn’t.

Also if the van can tow 2-3 tons it should be capable of carrying 1.4 tons? Or does the weight affect things differently

I doubt the payload is affecting the clutch. I had the old shape Vivaro and the gearbox gave up the ghost before the clutch.
All I'm trying to say is just because they claim the payload is 1400kgs I, personally, wouldn't believe it.
My Ducato, bought new, has 83K miles on it, is maxed out weight wise, is on it's 1st clutch

 

[Pjj]

Years ago I drove a Volkswagen t4 van when I worked for a heating company and had clutch issues with that Volkswagen reluctantly replaced the clutch at 3000 miles , and the service manager admitted that reverse gear was to high a ratio and that was what caused the issue shortly after that they changed the model .

 

[spruce]

You don't say what the problem is, but dual mass flywheels seem to be troublesome with most vans they are fitted to.

 

[Pjj]

You don't say what the problem is, but dual mass flywheels seem to be troublesome with most vans they are fitted to.

Very true and hideously expensive just the flywheel for the Renault was over £1000

 

[spruce]

Very true and hideously expensive just the flywheel for the Renault was over £1000

It also seems the manufacturer's (not only Renault) spares managers smoke wacky weed before they make the spare parts prices. I'm sure that these parts are priced to ensure the van is scrapped when it gets older. By the time you add the rest of the clutch components, the slave cylinder and labour, it's probably a lot more than the van is worth.

This is exactly what Bosch did with their power tool spares some 30 years ago. Price an armature so that, with labour to fit it, it was cheaper to buy a new tool.

 

[tench0771]

I was chatting to post man he was say 10000 miles cluch lasts in the Peugeot experts ?

 

[Master Jedi Alejandro]

I was chatting to post man he was say 10000 miles cluch lasts in the Peugeot experts ?

With how postmen treat their vans, it doesn’t surprise me. My Expert is on 60k and no issues. All that’s been needed is a front left ball joint. That didn’t surprise me cause it’s the one taking the most abuse. Cost me £100 fitted.

I’ll add I’ve only done 25k of those 60k. The first 35k it was a hire van (didn’t know when I brought it). So wouldn’t have been treated with much respect in that time.

 

[tench0771]

I’ll be switching vans next year looking at the proace or experts do you have the 2.0l or 1.6 ?

 

[Master Jedi Alejandro]

I’ll be switching vans next year looking at the proace or experts do you have the 2.0l or 1.6 ?

1.6. The older engine mated to a 5 speed. Can’t fault it. 6 speed would be good for motorway but I was happy as it’s a solid engine, been around for like 15/20 years I believe. Mine is a compact. Perfect for parking in residential areas!

 

[Crystalalan]

1.6. The older engine mated to a 5 speed. Can’t fault it. 6 speed would be good for motorway but I was happy as it’s a solid engine, been around for like 15/20 years I believe. Mine is a compact. Perfect for parking in residential areas!

Thats interesting. I`d be worried going for a 1.6. Thats a very small engine to be carrying all that weight.