I get a lot of air when I start up on each job, it only lasts seconds but the spurting is annoying. I read that some people put a spur in directly after the tank outlet but before the pump, maybe with a tap. Assuming you open the valve or tap how does that bleed the air, or is there a better way?
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Bleeding Air From System
- Thread starter essex boy
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Smurf
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Like I said before in another post run the pump flat out to get rid of any air until you get a constant flow rate.
Flat tanks are more prone to sucking in air into the pump hose intake as water sloshing about when driving or even parked on a hill or on a camber/curb when the tank is getting low.
Also disconnecting the hose reel without taps/stops on both ends so air can get in to the hose also exacerbate the issue which can affect the dead end stop on the controller too.
Flat tanks are more prone to sucking in air into the pump hose intake as water sloshing about when driving or even parked on a hill or on a camber/curb when the tank is getting low.
Also disconnecting the hose reel without taps/stops on both ends so air can get in to the hose also exacerbate the issue which can affect the dead end stop on the controller too.
HotWash Window Cleaners
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What type of tank do you have? Do you have any stop ends on hose like rectus or tap? Do you let your system run dry?
D
DanC
Air can be caused by not priming your pump well enough, some pumps wont prime through 100m of hose as its need air to do this, so dissconnect the hose from your hose reel and hang it out the door, turn your pump up too FULL and wait for all the air to come out your pump, you will see it spluttering for a few secs then switch off the flow controller while its on high reconnect to hose reel and you will be good to go. I had the same problem untill i learnt this trick.
Smurf
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Thats what I was saying exactly to do in another thread but guess no one listens to me /emoticons/biggrin.png
I have a grippamax flat tank and yes on the end of my hose i have water stops, i use pro 26 but same diferrence. the short connecting hose off of my reel into my ports is a male end so water does leek out of this, in other words the hose is not pressurised as water has an escape route.I need to use male on the port end so not sure what I can do about this as it will be a pain running pump flat out 25 times a day.
What I was getting at is some people make a spur from the tank outlet before the pump and connect a few feet of hose with a tap on the end. If I did that and ran the water by opening the tap I cannot see how that dispels air as it is directly off of the tank and before the pump.
What I was getting at is some people make a spur from the tank outlet before the pump and connect a few feet of hose with a tap on the end. If I did that and ran the water by opening the tap I cannot see how that dispels air as it is directly off of the tank and before the pump.
D
DanC
The hose attached to the output on the pump should not have an end stop and should run direct to your hose reel! if you try and prime the pump with the output hose attached to the hose reel this can cause the pump not to prime 100percent, you need to disconnect the input hose from the hose reel when you first prime a pump, you shouldnt have any problems with lower flow rates or air once it is primed, but to prime a pump it must first run on MAX for a few secs with out it connected to your hose reel! Im just not understanding when you are saying you have no pressure build up, Try posting some pics of your setup be alot easier! Once primed you should never need to prime it again unless your water runs out in the tank and you suck air in!
I do exactly what you are saying and understand. I have a tank, to pump, to water stop (under van port) so run short hose without reel at max and let water run for a few minutes and then pump is primed as all air dispelled. I do that and only get air if the water is low as I live in a hilly area and everything is on a steep gradient.
I totally understand what you are saying but because of where I work I can get air in the system.
What I am asking is, I have heard of people running an additional hose with a tap on it so they open the tap valve and water comes out and dispels any air thus priming the pump? Apparently they t-off a separate hose direct from the tank outlet. I just do not understand how that would dispel any air in the pump line.
Am I being stupid or does this work. Surely to do that I would have to have a spur after the pump in which case I see little point, might as well just do what you said earlier
I totally understand what you are saying but because of where I work I can get air in the system.
What I am asking is, I have heard of people running an additional hose with a tap on it so they open the tap valve and water comes out and dispels any air thus priming the pump? Apparently they t-off a separate hose direct from the tank outlet. I just do not understand how that would dispel any air in the pump line.
Am I being stupid or does this work. Surely to do that I would have to have a spur after the pump in which case I see little point, might as well just do what you said earlier
D
DanC
Ah see what you mean now, what size tank have you got? Lay flat tanks can be a problem on hills if your running low, I did away with my lay flat cos i seemed to struggle with the last 150 litres, got myself an upright instead, i cant see the extra t-off would work myself, might work if you run a T from your pump to a tap and just turn the tap on ouside the door now n then rather than keep disconnecting the hose reel. Id sell the lay flat and get an upright if i was you, if you had a 600 lay flat you wouldnt have the problem i would of thought, When i first started i had a 400 lay flat, it just wasnt big enough for me and used to drive me mad on hills.
I have a question for you - I have just realised (after 2 years which makes it all the sadder) that my air is not coming from an unprimed pump but because of the way I do things. My hose is clipped into my van but can stay in or out. I have underport connections so to connect my hose I have to plug into the underport so my shot peice of hose from pump/ underport to hose reel has to come outside the van.
When I finish a job I generally leave my pole hose connected to hosereel as it save wearing out the connector (I have used Pro26, Rectus 21, standard hoselocks) as I wear them out in a few weeks (apart from the plastic hoselocks they last 6 weeks) BUT i disconnect my short hose from the underport so that I can shut the van door, This brass connection does not have a water stop on it as is normal. Therefore next time I start a job I will reconnect to the port but obviously a certain amount of water will have travelled back and leaked out of the hosereel so when I reconnect everything there is air in the system which will be obvious after a few minutes when the air has travelled 100m through the hose.
Apart from everyone thinking I am an idiot which I already know, how do I stop that problem (and I cannot shut the van door with the short hose to the reel still in place)
Thanks
Smurf
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You could try these chepo hozeloc type taps? Also gardiners do something similar
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/WATER-FED-POLE-SYSTEM-HOSE-SHUT-OFF-VALVE-TWO-PACK-/151004235787?pt=UK_HomeGarden_CLV_Cleaning_CA&hash=item23288dc80b
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/WATER-FED-POLE-SYSTEM-HOSE-SHUT-OFF-VALVE-TWO-PACK-/151004235787?pt=UK_HomeGarden_CLV_Cleaning_CA&hash=item23288dc80b
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Smurf,Already have them but I dont think I am explaining myself.
When you work you either have your hosereel in the van or on the ground outside of the van. the hosereel is connected to the pump and in my van I connect it by inserting a male connection from the hose to port on my van which are connected to the pump. When I finish a job I out the hosereel back in the van and then have to disconect the hose from the ports under the van so I can shut the door. When I do this whater in the hose leeks out (not from the pole end as that has a water stop on it) from the hose attached to the spindle of the hosereel so next time I connect up there is air,
Do you have the same problem
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Smurf
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To be honest no not been any issue for me on the outlet side of the pump as it only takes seconds to flush through if air has got into the my100m hose reel due to disconnecting the feed hose to the reel that is if my pump is primed properly.
However I only get a problem when my intake hose sucks in air from my pf trolley that is just droped into the lid of my van tank. So when this happen I have to flush the air out of the system (prime the pump) by running the pump on full boar until i get a constant good flow rate then connect the hose reel & wfp and do the same until that too has a good constant flow rate.
After say that I still think your main issue is more likely air getting into the inlet side of the pump due to using a flat tank on hills.
However I only get a problem when my intake hose sucks in air from my pf trolley that is just droped into the lid of my van tank. So when this happen I have to flush the air out of the system (prime the pump) by running the pump on full boar until i get a constant good flow rate then connect the hose reel & wfp and do the same until that too has a good constant flow rate.
After say that I still think your main issue is more likely air getting into the inlet side of the pump due to using a flat tank on hills.
D
DanC
Thanks, I built the website myself, and run it myself, been learning web design and html for a few years now.
Also i keep my reels in the van, i just run it with the doors open, i found putting the hose in and out and playing with all the connections all the time takes up alot of time. I use hoselock to join the hose to the reel from the pump. I also use rectus 21 with a flow stop fitted to the 6mm hose so i have full control with flow rates and not having to go all the way back to the van to shut it off like i see wfp guys doing, saves water if you fit a flow valve. i keep the flow valve in my hand when working, i only seem to need to replace mine twice a year. Also i used to use 8mm hose but found after a while my elbow would get very painful, so i went over to a 6mm hose, best thing i did, so much lighter reeling in and out now! When i get some time this week ill post some images of all my setup, may help you get some ideas.
D
DanC
I never have any air issues myself, i even drop the pressure on my hose to rise my hands sometimes after a job. I Just had a thought, do you have calibration on the controller when the hose should cut out when the pressure builds? If you have this set to low that also could stop the pump priming after a job!
D
DanC
Ill make a new thread during the week, maybe we could get everyone to post a few images of there setups, we can all get some good ideas then.
HotWash Window Cleaners
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Could you attach the stop end suggested by Smurf to the hose reel, then plug hose into said fitting.
I do that but have to disconnect between jobs.I think the best answer is what Smurf said. I need to run a second feed from the pump which stays inside the van so I can leave hose tand pump connected and leave the reel in the van more often. I used to to that in my old van as I used a fixed hose reel but then found i needed to pull the hose out a lot as parking can be tight where I live and I cannot always get the best angle.
In fact, I have a two man set up, two pumps, two hoses and reels, so... I might as well fix one reel in the van and have one that pops out when needed.
Sometimes I am so thick!!!
