Tank position?

Discussion in 'Water Fed Pole Cleaning' started by Luke Barnard, Dec 6, 2015.

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  1. Luke Barnard

    Luke Barnard Active Member
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    I've just received a 500L upright tank from Wydale to replace my 350L flat tank and I'm planning to fabricate a frame similar to the Pure Freedom version and bolt it into the chassis.
    The van is a 2008 Nissan Primastar short wheel base and my question is how far from the bulkhead to mount the tank in order to get the weight distribution rite?
    If anybody's got one of these is a Primastar, vivaro or Traffic I'd really appreciate if you could measure the gap between the bulkhead and front of tank and give me a shout.
    Cheers.....
     
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  2. tench0771

    tench0771 Grand Master
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    [​IMG]ive got a lwb vivaro with a 500l uprite tank i think up againsted the bulk head is good as u can bolt tank fraim to that as well as the flore
     
  3. spruce

    spruce Grand Master
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    #3 spruce, Dec 7, 2015
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2015

    PureFreedom put a 650 liter tank up against the bulkhead (across the van) in a couple of swb Vivaro's I've seen, so you should be OK with a 500 liter tank there. ( Leave a small gap as you don't want the fabricated frame rubbing on the bulkhead.) I would put it there, fill it with water and secure it as best you can and get it weighed on a weighbridge to confirm that the front axle isn't overloaded.

    Truckers buy software programs that calculate their load positions. I occasionally follow a truckers blog in the US and although they use this calculator every time they load, they always double check that their axles aren't overloaded on a weigh bridge to make sure. Its a rough guide.

    Here is a simple formula to roughly calculate where the load you are carrying should be distributed. You will find a list of laden and unladen axle weights on a plate somewhere in the van - try inside driver's door or inside the engine bay.

    Add together the kerbside weight + the weight of the driver....
    Then subtract that from the stated gross weight on the plate, which gives you the weight that you're allowed to load (payload.)

    Then you have to be careful not to overload any individual axle.
    The individual axle weights are also given on the plate.

    Here's how to calculate the individual axle weights for a 2-axle rigid:
    [​IMG]
    In this example, the kerbside weight including the driver is 8 Tonnes.
    The load is 10 Tonnes, which in this case is evenly distributed, and the vehicle's GVW is given on the plate as 18 Tonnes.

    We now need to measure the distance between the centres of the axles to find the wheelbase, and found this to be 5 Mtrs as in the picture.
    We now measure the distance from the centre of the load to each axle and found that in this case it is 3 Mtrs to the front axle and 2 Mtrs to the rear axle as in the picture.

    Next, we use the formula in the picture, where
    P = payload,
    D = distance
    and W = wheelbase.

    So now to the calculation:
    10 x 2 = 20 divided by 5 = 4 Therefore the front axle weighs 4 Tonnes and the rear axle must weigh 6 Tonnes.

    NOTE: It doesn't matter which of the 2 "distances" you use, but you should remember that the answer that you get will be for the "other" axle. [​IMG]

    Doing the same calculation using the "other" distance will give you:
    10 x 3 = 30 divided by 5 = 6 Therefore the rear axle weighs 6 Tonnes and the front axle must weigh 4 Tonnes.
     
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  4. Luke Barnard

    Luke Barnard Active Member
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    Tank frame nearly finished.....what do you think? Any advice or anything I've missed?
     

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  5. Richard Paterson

    Richard Paterson Newcomer
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    I have just transferred my pure freedom frame (650 ltr) from a transit to my newer swb citroen relay. It was a major pain drilling into the chassis and used 4 drill bits and several layers of knuckle skin! Don't do it on the drive like I did try get a ramp. You ll need a several 6 or 8 inch bolts. Drill from bottom up to get alingment. Good luck!!
     
  6. spruce

    spruce Grand Master
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    It looks good. The welding looks very professional as well.

    Have you considered where to mount your pump and controller. I have the pumps on a board on the side of the tank. I throw an old duvet over the whole tank. Although I have a frost stat heater in the van in winter, a tank full of water at 8 or 9 degrees will stop the pumps from freezing up overnight.

    What size angle iron did you use? It looks like the base is different from the rest.
     
  7. Chris Dall

    Chris Dall Active Member
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    Ive got a 1000L that way in a LWB Trafic
     
  8. Luke Barnard

    Luke Barnard Active Member
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    Yeah it's surprising what you can do with an old mig welder, saved me a fortune on some of the cars I've owned!!!
    If you look at the second picture there are two parallel bars at the base of the frame which I'll tap to bolt the pump and di vessel to, not decided about the leisure battery yet but I like the controller next to the hose reel at the rear doors so thats staying put.
    Mounting wise it looks like you can safely mount anywhere between the bulkhead and accross the rear axel so I've gone for about 2ft back from the bulkhead which puts the rear of the tank inline with the front of the rear wheel and conveniently over both chassis rails and two crossmembers which means I can attach it with 14 m10 bolts which all go through the chassis! So its going nowhere!!!
    I've used 50mm angle iron with 3mm gauge for most of it and the tube is 25mm 3mm gauge, my total parcel weight from the Metal Shop was 46kg!!!
    Probably massive over engineering but my kids ride in my van all the time so I'd rather it be safe.
     
  9. spruce

    spruce Grand Master
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    #9 spruce, Dec 19, 2015
    Last edited: Dec 19, 2015

    Looks as though you have it all covered. Well done!

    I bought a mig welder 20 years ago but just couldn't get the hang of it. A bit stupid really as I have used a stick welder for close on 30 years.
     
  10. Luke Barnard

    Luke Barnard Active Member
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    Snapped my 10mm drill bit (hard to believe) so once I have another I can drill the last of the mounts, paint it and bolt it in, job done.....
    Never done stick arc or tig welding but with mig I find if you set the amps based on the material thickness, use argon-co2 mix gas, start with a high wire feed speed and on a piece of scrap the same as you intend to weld bring the speed down untill you get the sizzling bacon sound, thats the machine setup then the weld is just a series of tight arcs or small loops along the length of your joint.
    To start with you can easily get p##sed off with the torch popping and spitting and the bird s##t welds produced but get that out of the way on scrap metal and find the machines sweet spot then you can produce some nice looking (and more importantly strong) welds.
    Oh and make sure the metal to be joined is ground clean on both sides so you dont draw impurities into the weld.
     
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