It was a most profound statement...........

[Green Pro Clean Ltd]

It goes a little like this........

I am just starting a new van build so today I am my supplier collecting all the parts I had ordered (including my special order tank in GREEN /emoticons/smile.png) )

My supplier was very thin on staff today so as Adam was checking over my gear making sure all the nuts, bolts, bits n bobs were there another windy walks into the store.

He's perusing the WFP setups on display when he eyeballs my gear being piled up. (for the sake of clarity I would say this fellow is in hiss mid to late 50s)

We get to chatting and he says he is looking for a trolley system to get into WFP as he has been trad for last 30 years and then asks if I am just getting into WFP as he gestures towards my pile of goodies.

So I tell him no, I have been a windy for 10 years now and been WFP for the last 5, and that this is just a new build as I have sold my old one.

Now I was spending an easy £2k today which for some (myself included) is a lot of money but as we all know in the world of WFP and the price of some setups it really is nothing much.

What he says next really threw me and actually left me speechless.....

He said 'I been cleaning windows for 30 years, you only been doing it for 10 years and you can afford to buy a system like that?'

My mind was like WTF? Did he perhaps perceive me to be spending many times what I actually was or did he after 30 years of graft honestly think a £2k setup should be unaffordable to someone that has only been at it for 10 years?

Really messed with my head.

 

[Damo]

Reminds me of when a local cleaner asked if I still had my shitty old van and I said nope it's that new one over there. As I pulled away "don't stop believing" came on radio. Always makes me laugh.

I don't get the whole mentality of window cleaners. Some people bang on about £400 days yet can't afford £5 postage.

The problem with window cleaning is getting constant decent money day in and day out. I have managed to achieve my weekly and month to target for nearly 3 years now (sept16 is 3 years).

It's all to easy to have a decent Monday. Good Tuesday. Ok Wednesday. Ok ish Thursday. Half day Friday.

That's when 2k will seem a lot.

 

[RapidRyan]

As long as you have enough work you can justify the outlay of new equipment then it's not a problem. With WFP you have the chance to get more work done and take on more work = more money. So any extra equipment you buy literally pays for itself. I'm not bashing people who do trad I was one of them for 10 years. But my eyes were opened when I switched to WFP to the potential of what you can earn if you set your mind to building your business.

Sent using the Window Cleaning Forums app

 

[Solarpanelcleanington]

Surely the price of the new kit just goes into your quotes? That's how it works isn't it? And fuel and days off and all overheads?

 

[Green Pro Clean Ltd]

The cost of the gear was rather irrelevant.

What hit me was here was someone with 20 years seniority on me and he seemed to think buying equipment was an extravagance rather than an investment

 

[chris clean]

I know i may be generalising a bit here and I have no intention of offending anyone but this is from my own experience in my area. I have found since setting up that it is the guys who have been around for a long tume that have a chip on there shoulders about modern kit and also competition. There are loads of windies here but in no time thanks to loads of canvassing and advertising I've built up a really nice round and seeing good returns so far. There are other quite new set ups also doing real well and aknowledge u and chat basically the attitude is there's more than enough work to go round. The guys who have been onnit forever and tradding seem to have a real issue with newbies around. I like it and laugh to myself. Especially when I know of one in particular who charges about 5-7 quid a house and I know I'm doing one house wfp and he needs to do 3 or 4 on same road to earn same. As I say I know this is just what I have experienced and I know many are not atallespecially all the great guys on here who share there experience and that's what I hope if I do this job for 20 -30 years I will be like passing a bit of wisdom to the new guys not being bitter and twisted

 

[Cghwindowcleaning]

I have a newish van with good equipment and like green it amazes me that some people think you must have one the lottery.

Some window cleaners don"t see it as investment.

A new van and decent set up aren't a luxury their tools for the job.

The other ones that make me laugh which i'm seeing more of lately are the ones who say they won't get out of bed for less than £500 a day just picked up a £20k contract while standing next to a van worth about a tenner and then complaining about the cost of a new brush.

 

[Gavin]

He probably hasn't put his prices up in 20 of his 30 years. Maybe that's why

 

[CHWS]

I question what some people say they earn on here, I can't see how anyone would begrudge spending money on gear etc. Makes me think a lot of people are full off poo

 

[chris clean]

I think there is a lot of bull about how much people earn not just on here but out and about. for me personally I am earning more doing this job at moment than any other job I have had being paid by others if not much more. But what it does give me is freedom to pick when I work and to be home every night and see the Mrs and kiss my child goodnight. That to me is the real good bit.

 

[Damo]

Totally agree.

I can't hide the fact I do well as I like nice gear but I also use the best gear to make my earnings.

I could not bang out the days I do with a 400g brush and a 2kg pole. Ain't gonna happen.

 

[Green Pro Clean Ltd]

£30+ per hour is quite doable in this game, however doing say £30 per hour for a straight 8 hours does not happen.

By the time an 8 hour day is done you have spent 2 hours having a break and chatting here and there so already your 8 hours at £30 = £240 is down two hours = £180. Take out say £30 for van running etc so down to £150.00 still respectable. 5 days a week that's £750 less 20% for Her Majesty that still leaves £600 in your pocket so without working too hard at all you can for just a four week month be on a take home clear wage of £28'800.

Truth is closer to £25K by the time you have had a missed job here, rained off there etc.

Now @Damo said it just earlier, the thing is most don't have the work / client base to draw that reliable daily earn, a lot will have 2 or 3 good days a week and a couple of days with just an odd job here or there. The secret is to have them all lined up so every day is a good day.

I am realizing more and more that in this business it is simply those willing to apply themselves and build that will be the success stories, then it's those that are happy to chip a living to cover bills and enjoy a holiday or two here and there and then it's the outright sullbhits that's talk a good game and that's all they do, play a good game. They get up, go out, do a couple of hours then a quick break round the mates for a cuppa that turn into a pint or two, the whole time talking about how sweet it is to be earning £30 per hour yet the whole time not realizing they are always skint because they don't have the discipline and only do 2 hours 3 or 4 days a week and are making £50 or £60 per day.

I have respect for so many on here (and on the street) and by the same numbers a total lack of respect for many others that just seem to want to waste time and not be bothered.

I think of it like the mechanics, there are three groups.

• The spotless showroom, all the latest computer dodahs and the best spanners money can buy, staff in overalls that were clean on that morning and actually wipe their hands as they come over to shake yours. You know it's not going to be cheap but the work will be guaranteed and the framed training certificates and awards on the walls let you know the chaps are clued up as to what they do.
  
• The old school workshop, the tools are older than me and the mechanics overalls would give a bottle of Ariel Fresh a heart attack, however everything is in it's place, everything organized and he still wipes his hands as he comes over to shake yours, he does not need the computer doodahs as he can tel whats wrong by tilting his head to the side and listening closely. (this is where I take my motor BTW) Oldschool. You know any issues with the work he will see you right.
  
• Lastly the totally unsuitable garage at the side of grannies bungalow that she lets the kids use, where there is a half box of tools in the corner, the overalls are a pair of shite covered knock off Armani jeans and a Primark t-shirt, more empty Stella cans than oil cans laying around and one lad that knows how to change a tyre and 3 more that hang about and lie to each other about back in the day in their RS or St or WRX (that they never actually owned) etc etc where as the truth is the last thing they 'drove' was their kids bike to Cash Converters to pawn it off for another six pack of Stella and the only industry terms they know the learnt watching 'The Fast & The Furious' You know that if one of these jokers so much as looks at your van sideways your're gonna wanna smack him.
  

It reminds me of a fellow I met on one of my 'posher' jobs one day.........

I seen him around, never spoke to him before, he drives possibly the rattiest crappiest van in the country. I pull up to my job and as i'm preparing my gear it turns out he's a couple of doors down. (now do remember this is the first time I ever spoke to or acknowledged him and this is word for word how the conversation went'

Him: 'Alright mate'

Me: 'Hello'

Him : How you doing'

Me 'Good thanks, you?'

Him: 'Yeah, I got 2'800 customers a month'

Me 'Must crack on'

As I simply inserted my earphones, turned up Alice Cooper and waled off thinking 'To$$er'

I aint no rocket scientist but even I can work out that 2'800 clients per month (based on a 30 day month) is 93 clients per day, let's say he's quick, 10 mins per job max, that's 15 1/2 hours of flat out graft.

Why do people do that? I am more interested in hearing about how quality rounds are built and good business models that earn modest sums as opposed to the fairy land boys that have a Ferrari in the garage and made £10k last week.

 

[Jamesndc]

£30+ per hour is quite doable in this game, however doing say £30 per hour for a straight 8 hours does not happen.
By the time an 8 hour day is done you have spent 2 hours having a break and chatting here and there so already your 8 hours at £30 = £240 is down two hours = £180. Take out say £30 for van running etc so down to £150.00 still respectable. 5 days a week that's £750 less 20% for Her Majesty that still leaves £600 in your pocket so without working too hard at all you can for just a four week month be on a take home clear wage of £28'800.

Truth is closer to £25K by the time you have had a missed job here, rained off there etc.

Now @Damo said it just earlier, the thing is most don't have the work / client base to draw that reliable daily earn, a lot will have 2 or 3 good days a week and a couple of days with just an odd job here or there. The secret is to have them all lined up so every day is a good day.

I am realizing more and more that in this business it is simply those willing to apply themselves and build that will be the success stories, then it's those that are happy to chip a living to cover bills and enjoy a holiday or two here and there and then it's the outright sullbhits that's talk a good game and that's all they do, play a good game. They get up, go out, do a couple of hours then a quick break round the mates for a cuppa that turn into a pint or two, the whole time talking about how sweet it is to be earning £30 per hour yet the whole time not realizing they are always skint because they don't have the discipline and only do 2 hours 3 or 4 days a week and are making £50 or £60 per day.

I have respect for so many on here (and on the street) and by the same numbers a total lack of respect for many others that just seem to want to waste time and not be bothered.

I think of it like the mechanics, there are three groups.

• The spotless showroom, all the latest computer dodahs and the best spanners money can buy, staff in overalls that were clean on that morning and actually wipe their hands as they come over to shake yours. You know it's not going to be cheap but the work will be guaranteed and the framed training certificates and awards on the walls let you know the chaps are clued up as to what they do.
  
• The old school workshop, the tools are older than me and the mechanics overalls would give a bottle of Ariel Fresh a heart attack, however everything is in it's place, everything organized and he still wipes his hands as he comes over to shake yours, he does not need the computer doodahs as he can tel whats wrong by tilting his head to the side and listening closely. (this is where I take my motor BTW) Oldschool. You know any issues with the work he will see you right.
  
• Lastly the totally unsuitable garage at the side of grannies bungalow that she lets the kids use, where there is a half box of tools in the corner, the overalls are a pair of shite covered knock off Armani jeans and a Primark t-shirt, more empty Stella cans than oil cans laying around and one lad that knows how to change a tyre and 3 more that hang about and lie to each other about back in the day in their RS or St or WRX (that they never actually owned) etc etc where as the truth is the last thing they 'drove' was their kids bike to Cash Converters to pawn it off for another six pack of Stella and the only industry terms they know the learnt watching 'The Fast & The Furious' You know that if one of these jokers so much as looks at your van sideways your're gonna wanna smack him.
  

It reminds me of a fellow I met on one of my 'posher' jobs one day.........

I seen him around, never spoke to him before, he drives possibly the rattiest crappiest van in the country. I pull up to my job and as i'm preparing my gear it turns out he's a couple of doors down. (now do remember this is the first time I ever spoke to or acknowledged him and this is word for work how the conversation went'

Him: 'Alright mate'

Me: 'Hello'

Him : How you doing'

Me 'Good thanks, you?'

Him: 'Yeah, I got 2'800 customers a month'

Me 'Must crack on'

As I simply inserted my earphones, turned up Alice Cooper and waled off thinking 'To$$er'

I aint no rocket scientist but even I can work out that 2'800 clients per month (based on a 30 day month) is 93 clients per day, let's say he's quick, 10 mins per job max, that's 15 1/2 hours of flat out graft.

Why do people do that? I am more interested in hearing about how quality rounds are built and good business models that earn modest sums as opposed to the fairy land boys that have a Ferrari in the garage and made £10k last week.

Lol

2800 lol I've got about that and have 4 staff then myself lmao

I totally agree with all above.

It's rather miss leading when people mention how much they earn.

Nobody ever mentions there worst rounds/days, and from my experience you do have those days when starting or building rounds. It also helps you, gives you the knowledge and experience to then learn to adapt or change to make more money or to have an easier working day/round etc.

Sent using the Window Cleaning Forums app

 

[Dave B]

Is cheapncheerful back??

What an essay @Green Pro Clean Ltd :rofl:

I had the same conversation with Damo before

Anyone can get ladders or cheap wfp and earn money

However they will never earn what it is possible to earn and will always be struggling to get the job done

Buying good tools and parts including a diy setup but using good stuff not cheap "that'll do" parts is an investment which will turn your "job" into your "business" and set you up for the future

 

[Damo]

My saying has always been.

People get confused with best day VS average day.

Dave knows what my rounds like. Some good. Some bad. Some Dominic little wood. But on average it's good.

 

[peter rogers]

Buying gear which is **** annoys me. But button gear that is good. Doesn't be problem

Sent using the Window Cleaning Forums app

 

[Dave B]

Haha

Dominic littlewood

Rip off Britain

 

[Damo]

HahaDominic littlewood

Rip off Britain

Have you seen anyone cry when they hand over money? Lol.

The lean too roof will be interesting. Maybe we should have a guessing game on the price /emoticons/smile.png)

 

[Dave B]

Gotta be 3 digits i reckon

 

[Haynesy]

If you lot seen my van you would think im the scraggiest window cleaner around, it is literally ******, I'm like a hilbilly driving around but can't afford to buy a new van at the moment. Saving money for December to try and buy another one. However I got thrown into the deep end 9 months a go with no training and have not had a single complaint so far. I literally kill myself while working though which is not good, worked on a commercial job on my own a couple of months a go and grafted 9 hours without one single break, I had a can of pop while working but not even one sit down. Earnt a lot but I'm hoping when I'm in the gym my hourly rate will increase

 

[Pigeon]

your tecnique will earn you money not your guns, also remember to quote so you can earn a good hourly rate without breaking sweat