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Diwrnach

Did you know the oldest bible in existence doesn't even mention Jesus? how odd is that?

 

Also about that Kind james bible that a large amount of Christians follow, here is an original found where they have gone through it and told them where to re write and change it http://www.addictinginfo.org/2015/10/28/handwritten-draft-of-king-james-bible-discovered-reveals-no-divine-powers/

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Diwrnach
Lol dirwnach there is plenty of proof Jesus lived mate, weather you believe he's god or not that's fine, but he was a real person,

 

You can't feel gravity, but you know it's there, you can't see oxygen, but you know it's there,

 

I can't help but feel like you've had a really bad expierence with religion ?

 

Im not arguing with you by the way, but you do need to look at both sides of the story sometimes, I appreciate you hate religion, that's fine, but your by far he most hostile towards it...

 

Anyway, glad your heart is better, it's not nice being ill

Show me the proof please.

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Jake

There's loads and loads of articles dirwnach, Google it, I'm not a gonna start posting history lessons :rofl:

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Diwrnach

Look up the Sinai bible, its the oldest known to exist, there is no resurrection etc in it, without Christs resurrection you don't have Christianity.

 

The entire thing rests on a false hypothesis that people were created by dirt and ribs and evolution didn't happen, we know both of those things to be false, without the creation being real there is no reason for any of it as it all hinges on Eves sin, there was no Eve.

 

I have studied history and religions of all kinds for many, many years, the entire Christian myth isn't even original it is plagerised from earlier myths, its all a load of none sense.

 

I have nothing against people with religion though, don't get me wrong, people can believe whatever none sense they want, but just like cancer, I hate cancer but don't hate those with cancer, I hate religion but not religious folks.

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Diwrnach
There's loads and loads of articles dirwnach, Google it, I'm not a gonna start posting history lessons :rofl:

I don't need to google anything, there is NOT ONE BIT OF PROOF he existed, none, zilch, zero.

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Jake
I don't need to google anything, there is NOT ONE BIT OF PROOF he existed, none, zilch, zero.

 

Ok that's fine :)

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Diwrnach
Ok that's fine :)

That is always the reply when the single word of "proof" is mentioned, you just get wishy washy "feel it in my heart" answers, or no answer at all.

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Diwrnach

The Christian god is quoted to exist in the places where we lack knowledge, God is getting smaller and smaller and smaller every single day, we know how animals including ourselves evolved, we know the sun orbits the earth and not the other way round, we know so many things that before the answer was "God did it" the reply of "god did it" is the reply to less and less all the time, currently God is very small as our knowledge gap is getting smaller, soon he will have knowhere to hide.

 

The reason I dislike religion on the whole is fairy easy really, gay people are currently being tortured and burnt alive in some places on this planet at the coaxing of religious preachers, American preacher went to Africa and got a bill passed to kill gay people, that is what they're doing, it holds us back at every single turn, stem cell research has been held back years and years due to religious involvement, currently Syria and the whole middle east is completely insane fighting over whos imaginary friend is the right one, its pure insanity.

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Jake

I suppose it's a bit like in 2000 years time, no one can 'prove' hitler existed, we will rely on stories and literature, books etc, same as Jesus...

 

We can't prove he didn't exist either? Just like we can't prove a lot of things in life...

 

All I'm saying diwrnach, is that sometimes an open mind isn't a bad thing, I can see you strongly disagree with religion, it's very very clear, but I sometimes wonder why your so hostile towards it,

 

It's remarkable that the bible has survived for 2000 years, no other book has sold more, no other book has been so well preserved, it's quite amazing.

 

I'm not an expert, and I'm not into history, so I'm chiming out of that now, i have no need to argue about it...

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Jimroot

Religion does seem a bit of a comfort blanket. What rankles is when people insist it's all 'true' 'the only way' etc. based on a book that was wirtten after the events, thousands of years ago. It's no truer than believing in fairies cause someone wrote about them once upon a time. It might be true. It might not. There's no way of ultimately proving either, it's just less likely that not

 

Information gets corrupted after just a few copies, let alone all this time and people and politics getting in the mix.

 

Be good if a JW could come on and correct this, but I was once told by a guy very into it and not a junior in their organisation, that only a certain number of followers (20,000?) get into the afterlife realm where they live with lions and other animals (vegetarian lions?) That's not much incentive to new comers?

 

Like, if I want to get in, do I have to be 'better' than you? And just by wanting to be better to get something and deprive you of eternal happiness doesn't that make me 'worse'?

 

Also, I asked another 'deeply religious' person, 'what's if I'm really good as a person, but I just don't happen to have heard of or been exposed to your religion, can I get into heaven?' 'No' was the answer. That kind of sums up religion, not spirituality, it's a club, with a status, usually a patriarch, dues to pay, sacrifices to make on the promise of afterlife unprovable reward.

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Diwrnach
I suppose it's a bit like in 2000 years time, no one can 'prove' hitler existed, we will rely on stories and literature, books etc, same as Jesus...

 

We can't prove he didn't exist either? Just like we can't prove a lot of things in life...

 

All I'm saying diwrnach, is that sometimes an open mind isn't a bad thing, I can see you strongly disagree with religion, it's very very clear, but I sometimes wonder why your so hostile towards it,

 

It's remarkable that the bible has survived for 2000 years, no other book has sold more, no other book has been so well preserved, it's quite amazing.

 

I'm not an expert, and I'm not into history, so I'm chiming out of that now, i have no need to argue about it...

That's the thing Jake we CAN rely on historical records to prove a great many things, things in fact much older than Jesus, but that right there is the entire point, there are no reliable historical records for Jesus, none, the first accounts of his life were written HUNDREDS of years after his supposed death, the first bible was hundreds of years later.

 

There is not ONE single reliable piece of real historical evidence he existed, not one, I have searched for it myself for several years, to believe in something without any form of evidence whatsoever is insane.

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Neil nowdownunder

My experience started with a prayer (an Invitation) and resulted in a physical encounter which changed my life. Reading the book came after.

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Diwrnach

Oh and don't pull the "you can't prove he didn't exist" card, that is just silly, the burdon of proof is on the person making the assertion, if I told you there was a big green dragon behind the moon it would be up to me to prove myself right, not up to you to prove me wrong.

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Diwrnach
My experience started with a prayer (an Invitation) and resulted in a physical encounter which changed my life. Reading the book came after.

I just read your page, in your own words "At the time I was taking anti-depressant tablets, which caused me to have irregular heart rhythms. This was worsened by caffeine and sugar. I was also suffering from insomnia"

 

Then while having not slept for a long time you had a vision of Jesus after asking to see him, now I will openly admit now to when younger taking a lot of drugs and not sleeping for long periods of time, I have seen, heard and been touched by much more impressive things than jesus, this my friend was your own mind, you were having a trip.

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Jake
God bless you all, nite nite :).

 

You'll probably awake to a 50 page debate in the morning,

 

Right now it's early in the day here in uk, so this thread will go ballistic in the next 12 hours :rofl:

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Diwrnach

Look up DMT, its responsible for all these life after death experiences and is in large amounts in our brains, please look it up and don't assume to know what it is.

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Danfire

If you all set up a direct debit into my account I promise that when you die you will float off to a magical wonderland where you will live forever, if you like I will also turn that old crippled body and mind into a young, healthy one...could you all hurry up and do it sooner rather than later, I've got a pig of a first clean lined up next week that I'd rather not do.

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Jake
I just read your page, in your own words "At the time I was taking anti-depressant tablets, which caused me to have irregular heart rhythms. This was worsened by caffeine and sugar. I was also suffering from insomnia"

 

Then while having not slept for a long time you had a vision of Jesus after asking to see him, now I will openly admit now to when younger taking a lot of drugs and not sleeping for long periods of time, I have seen, heard and been touched by much more impressive things than jesus, this my friend was your own mind, you were having a trip.

 

You don't see things when drinking coffee on anti depressants :rofl:

 

Give it a rest D, we know how you feel...

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Diwrnach
You don't see things when drinking coffee on anti depressants :rofl:

 

Give it a rest D, we know how you feel...

I can tell you right now from experience, if you want the very best hallucinations don't sleep for awhile.

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Jake

You can't prove he didn't have a real encounter either,

 

It's changed his life, so it was clearly a very real encounter, think of the millions of people doing drugs that see things, it always makes them more paranoid and more messed up, never better, he's now off anti depressants and sleeping well, so it's contrary to the norm, (I know this first hand having lived with a heroin addict for 2 years, hallucinations don't change people's lives for the better, they make it worse, they certainly don't bring piece and then good nights sleep)

 

Back to work now, rains stopping.

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