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Surfactants lads???

NCS

Member
Messages
58
Have to bite the bullet and see about ordering some surfactant online. Any recommendations on which is working better for you; I'm not so bothered where I purchase at, just as long as I'm buying good stuff. Out with the fairy for now.

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Over on another forum one of the biggest Softwashing companies on there is saying they use fairy liquid exclusively as surfactant. 

 
Never heard of that before Chris, if you look st the chemical makeup of Fairy it's basically a surfactant with a type of biocide in it. Going by what I've read on other forums fairy does the job at a fraction of the cost of softwashing branded surfactants. As I said there is a big Softwashing company on another forum who says he only uses fairy in his mixes and swears by it. He is doing big commercial jobs all the time so I'm listening to what the guy is saying as he has a very successful Softwashing business and has no need to make up Fairy tales,, pardon the pun!!!  :1f603:

 
Have you ever seen what happens when you add fairy to strong hypo?

Instantly you get a froth on the top caused by the production of chlorine gas due to it being unsuitable as a surfactant for hypo 

If i have no other choice i will use it but if i have a proper surfactant handy i would use that

When hypo breaks down it produces mostly sodium chloride (table salt) and water

Even if the small amount of chlorine gas doesn't bother you why would you want to spray hypo that is already breaking down on a surface to be cleaned?

Surely you would want it 100% effective?

Not saying it can't be used but a lot more suitable products out there 

 
P&g don't even disclose all the ingredients of fairy so how can you know what the reaction would be

This is all i can find of their ingredients online and you would need to know how each one reacts with hypo to know if it is suitable

Aqua
• Sodium laureth sulphate
• Alcohol denat
• Lauramine oxide
• C9-11 pareth-8
• Sodium chloride
• 1,3-Cyclohexanedimethanamine
• PPG (polypropylene glycols)
• Dimethyl aminoethyl methecrylate/hydroxyproply acrylate copolymer cirate
• Parfum
• Geraniol
• Limonene
• Colourant

 
Ok, I wouldn't stick anything straight into strong hypo myself. Water then add hypo then the surfactants. So what is the best surfactant to use as there is many so called Softwashing surfactants now available. 

 
Clever wash is good but expensive

I don't know much about others as i haven't used them

Fairy will do the job but that is your choice what to use

I have cleaned several conny roofs and patios using fairy and not saying it doesn't work.. just that it is not the most ideal surfactant to use

In fact i will be using some asda washing up liquid tomorrow for a conny roof as i have been lazy and not ordered anything for a while as i only do add ons for existing customers nowadays 

 
The main problem is if you damage any property or pets etc your insurance will want to know what you were using and the way the law is on using chems not fit for purpose they may invalidate your insurance

Technically using hypo made for swimming pool treatment is a grey area as the authorities can say it is a pesticide designed for the dairy farming trade etc and not legally suitable for use for other purposes as the msds and cosh paperwork doesn't state it is for the purpose you are using it for

You could be crafty and order some blackwash from benz and use that container for normal hypo and say that is what you are using

I'm only going by my own research and what i found on Benz website

The true legality of it i am still not 100% sure of

 
We use fairy liquid but have found that it turns into a gel like substance at the bottom of the sprayer and cloges up the pump , if you try and dilute it before adding it to the hypo it frothes up and goes everywhere so don't know what's best to use , I've Hurd some use amine ???  

 
Excellent info Dave, what's really puzzling me here is that guy over on another forum swears by using Fairy for all his Softwashing jobs. By the sounds of things here its emergency use only if you don't have anything else to use at the time. 

I know Mr Green has finished Softwashing etc, but he would be probably the best guy on these boards to tell us what works and where to get it! 

 
Excellent info Dave, what's really puzzling me here is that guy over on another forum swears by using Fairy for all his Softwashing jobs. By the sounds of things here its emergency use only if you don't have anything else to use at the time. 

I know Mr Green has finished Softwashing etc, but he would be probably the best guy on these boards to tell us what works and where to get it! 
some people swear by fairy or baby shampoo or even horse shampoo,these are the guys i'd give a very wide berth as they have no idea-well yes they do in fact,the idea of saving one or two pounds.

if you are using sodium hypochlorite there are only two surfactants to choose from,

lauramine oxide

sodium laureth sulthate or sles for short.

both these surfactants work well with hypo as they share the same range of ph 

i could go on and on about this but to keep it short if you want/need to buy surfactant for hypo its easier to buy some of mark caves stuff-(and it really pains me to say this)from bonnymans

it will do what you need it to do/last for ages and no need to keep popping into asda for some cheap washing up liquid

 
some people swear by fairy or baby shampoo or even horse shampoo,these are the guys i'd give a very wide berth as they have no idea-well yes they do in fact,the idea of saving one or two pounds.

if you are using sodium hypochlorite there are only two surfactants to choose from,

lauramine oxide

sodium laureth sulthate or sles for short.

both these surfactants work well with hypo as they share the same range of ph 

i could go on and on about this but to keep it short if you want/need to buy surfactant for hypo its easier to buy some of mark caves stuff-(and it really pains me to say this)from bonnymans

it will do what you need it to do/last for ages and no need to keep popping into asda for some cheap washing up liquid


as per the link I left in other words

 
and sodium laureth sulphate is commonly used in baby shampoo which is also non oxidising and less likely to break down the hypo so it is a better cheap alternative to Fairy. But 'cheap' being the operative word. It's far from ideal and I agree with alternatives mentioned.

Below is link for sodium lauryl sulpahte (laureth is a milder version of lauryl).

And why anyone would recommend Fairy is beyond me. Just try it and find out what a waste of time is it.

https://aimscleaninghub.co.uk/product/sodium-laureth-sulphate-sles-27-sodium-lauryl-ether-sulphate/?gclid=Cj0KCQjw0ejNBRCYARIsACEBhDOEwBtYDV4ScecvHa08T64mSfxpbejJxNsWVo793fIia1XPPjqKAoEaAnWGEALw_wcB

 
Great information lads really good thanks so much. So how much of this surfactant would you mix with say 100 litres of SH mix? (Water included)


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I've just been put half a litre in or there abouts.


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300 mill of clever wash to 20l of 15% hypo works best its like £35 for 5 leters to will treat 10 drums of hypo with is prity cheep realy considering what you can urn with 10- drums of hypo

 

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