Are window cleaners still allowed to work during Coronavirus (Covid-19)?

[Bumblebee72]

Im not disagreeing im just confused with all this coz for the ones that carry on working there standing to pocket a lot of money and I cant see the government allowing this to happen as the point of the grant is to STOP people working .

say if you get a £1000 a week and there is only 4 weeks In a month to make it easy as technically its 4.5 weeks .

That's £4000 yes so you keep on working and lose lets say 10%  making it £3600 for the month . So on top of that your going to get for your monthly payment a grant of £3200 if its a flat rate there dishing out so in grand total that's £6800  to which lets say you be taxed at 20% roughly giving you a whopping £5440 a month after tax deduction ………..there isn't a CAT IN HELLS CHANCE ITS GOING TO WORK LIKE THIS . That would be actively encouraging you to work .

So as I see it its not going to be a blanket grant its going to only top you up to what you should usually get if you work . So therefore you lot who are going back to work are going back to work for bloody nothing .As surely this is about encouraging you not to work .

Or am I missing something ovious here ??.

I know the max u can get a month is £2500 before I get a clever **** answer but the point is the same .

The only reason I can see to work is if you haven't been honest on your tax returns or you don't qualify for the 80% and even then there is WTC or UC or ESA ? . 

And agreed NIC is deffo going up .

When it's all over the Government will send every self employed person a questionnaire.  This will ask if you've had to stop work and how much income you've lost. (Or more probably how much you've managed to earn) If you've carried on working and then claim the grant I'm guessing there's a nice comfy cell with your name on it?

 

[fast_muchly]

When it's all over the Government will send every self employed person a questionnaire.  This will ask if you've had to stop work and how much income you've lost.  If you've carried on working and then claim the grant I'm guessing there's a nice comfy cell with your name on it?

So what the hell is the point in working ……….Im really STRUGGLING to see the point it the people who are working I really am .

 

[Dave B]

They are not saying should,  on the government guidelines which we all agree is the best source legally it uses the words may/can. It's up to you,  although LParker's experience shows how we are dealing with the unknown and does bring it home. 

There you go.. government website.

First paragraph.

Interpret that any other way than you should work.

 

[Part Timer]

If you've carried on working and then claim the grant I'm guessing there's a nice comfy cell with your name on it?

Just work and don't take payment for 3 months then, can't prove anything if you're sensible. There are 5 million self employed that in most cases won't know what they've lost because of the nature of their particular business. Are the taxmen, the very same that can't catch the real fiddlers, going to be able to investigate and prove that as that's what they'll have to do to get you jailed for fraud.

 

[Lparker9983]

When it's all over the Government will send every self employed person a questionnaire.  This will ask if you've had to stop work and how much income you've lost.  If you've carried on working and then claim the grant I'm guessing there's a nice comfy cell with your name on it?

The worst case I suppose is they stop the payment from next year after seeing your tax return for march April may or other income into bank accounts . This is fair as if you aren't affected you shouldnt be claiming the grant. 

Ive signed onto PAYE and if get the work it will be on my tax return next year, if they decide to deduct the income from the grant then that's fine with me as I've been earning. I don't expect that I can work full time during the grant period and still get away claiming a full 80% but I don't know the rules. All we can do is wait and see.

 

[Tormato]

There you go.. government website.

First paragraph.

Interpret that any other way than you should work.View attachment 19944

It says in the full guidance on the same page may/can. Nowhere are they ordering anyone in non essential work to go out. They are saying you can. They have left the decision to us based on what we know about our own job/round, circumstances etc. 

It's a personal choice. I thought we'd all agreed on that a while back?

 

[Dave B]

Apart from where it says it's important for business to carry on.

 

[Neil.. Lancashire]

They always mention Covid-19 deaths numbers every day in the media ....but as you say never say how many in each age bracket  dies, and often do not mention numbers who also had "other health issues".If they did the population would have a clearer indication as to how the virus is affecting the nation.  

These figures were published a few days ago

48% of people who are in icu because of covid 19 die

25% of 16 to 40 year olds also die

not great.

medlife crisi youtube channel.

 

[Doo]

Yes it's hard to know what to do and I get that as I was 'shall I shall I not' for days last week but my van hasn't turned a key since last Tues and I can't see it doing until I can do it safely. 

The government are paying me to sit here and my customers that I have contacts for Inc businesses are fine and just expresses thanks for the contact to say I hadn't just closed the business.

End of the day it's the individuals call to make but I had to express my concern! 

I got my daughter to join various Facebook groups for areas I work (I don't do Facebook) to put a message on explaining where I stand on all this all replies were really positive and all say my decision to stay at home the correct decision they all said they would see me when I felt it was safe to work again and appreciated me keeping them updated .

 

[Tormato]

Apart from where it says it's important for business to carry on.

Apart from it's my business and I can do what I want. If I do/don't want to work is my decision. The government can't order me to work any day of the year never mind during a pandemic. I don't get why you think they are ordering us out. We're self employed. 

 

[Dave B]

It says in the full guidance on the same page may/can. Nowhere are they ordering anyone in non essential work to go out. They are saying you can. They have left the decision to us based on what we know about our own job/round, circumstances etc. 

It's a personal choice. I thought we'd all agreed on that a while back?

I agree it's a personal choice but am getting told we should not be working and we are wrong.

I always said do what you need to do but don't go preaching your stance on this is correct and ours wrong 

 

[Part Timer]

For those that understand the risks and need to work with the minimum amount of risk then I personally would do it this way. Have a bucket, with a lid, of diluted bleach in the van. Pull up at first job, put on gloves, remove bucket and wash gloves in bleach. Do job come back to van wash gloves in bucket outside of van. Reel hose in using a cloth soaked in a solution of bleach, put pole away and rinse gloves. Put bucket in back of van close door and move to next job, with or without gloves on, repeat. If anyone can constructively pull holes in this please do so as this is aimed at making it safer for everyone and not to cause an argument. 

 

[Markyboy 50]

For those that understand the risks and need to work with the minimum amount of risk then I personally would do it this way. Have a bucket, with a lid, of diluted bleach in the van. Pull up at first job, put on gloves, remove bucket and wash gloves in bleach. Do job come back to van wash gloves in bucket outside of van. Reel hose in using a cloth soaked in a solution of bleach, put pole away and rinse gloves. Put bucket in back of van close door and move to next job, with or without gloves on, repeat. If anyone can constructively pull holes in this please do so as this is aimed at making it safer for everyone and not to cause an argument. 

What about if you’re trad?

 

[Part Timer]

What about if you’re trad?

The method would be very much the same I would think except you might need to chuck squeegee in the bleach, as long as you wash gloves before and after. I've never done trad, except internal and ground floor, so those using ladders should be able to amend if required.

 

[Digitalwindowcleaner]

You lot should search / the spectator corona virus / ,all testing is being done in hospitals to people that are already ill. So by default all the data shows the government a 5% plus death rate, multiply that through society then you have your answer shut everything down. Except healthy people are not in hospital are not even being tested for the virus, figures are actually no worse than flu. To make this even worse if you die of pneumonia( which is what all these deaths are) they test you for corona if it's positive then it's a corona death. If you die of pneumonia you are not tested for the flu virus so not recorded as flu, flu death rates are approx 0.1% without this testing. Estimates for death rates from corona virus between 0.25 and 1% but this is with testing. If everyone that has died of pneumonia in the past had been tested for the flu virus and recorded in the same way as corona is then it is undeniable, this is no worse than the flu outbreak that happens every year. World death rates will remain constant and all this is for nothing. Sweden have best idea keep all vulnerable and old at home let everyone else carry on, will be interesting to see if they fair better or worse than everyone else. Like I say google spectator corona virus

It's worse in that it'll overwhelm the health systems around the world. The flu isn't as contagious, and the speed at which coronavirus spreads in such a short amount of time, is the problem. 

 Anybody comparing corona to the common flu is completely missing the point!

 

[Jason g]

Im not disagreeing im just confused with all this coz for the ones that carry on working there standing to pocket a lot of money and I cant see the government allowing this to happen as the point of the grant is to STOP people working .

say if you get a £1000 a week and there is only 4 weeks In a month to make it easy as technically its 4.5 weeks .

That's £4000 yes so you keep on working and lose lets say 10%  making it £3600 for the month . So on top of that your going to get for your monthly payment a grant of £3200 if its a flat rate there dishing out so in grand total that's £6800  to which lets say you be taxed at 20% roughly giving you a whopping £5440 a month after tax deduction ………..there isn't a CAT IN HELLS CHANCE ITS GOING TO WORK LIKE THIS . That would be actively encouraging you to work .

So as I see it its not going to be a blanket grant its going to only top you up to what you should usually get if you work . So therefore you lot who are going back to work are going back to work for bloody nothing .As surely this is about encouraging you not to work .

Or am I missing something ovious here ??.

I know the max u can get a month is £2500 before I get a clever **** answer but the point is the same .

The only reason I can see to work is if you haven't been honest on your tax returns or you don't qualify for the 80% and even then there is WTC or UC or ESA ? . 

And agreed NIC is deffo going up .

More like if you earn £30k gross About £575 per week - after expenses etc netts down to 20k about £385 per week.

80% of £385 is about £308.  So it’s £308 per week you will receive not £575 which is actually about 53-54% of your weekly income.

after that you will be taxed on the £308 at a later date.

 

[Bumblebee72]

Would you trust the taxman to 'play fair'?  In view of Dave B's very clear post, isn't it possible that the taxman will take the view that as we are told it is ok to work, and we take the decision ourselves not to then we disqualify ourselves from eligibility for the payment?.........just a thought.

 

[KenBoon]

I've been watching this thread for a while.

So I've asked should I work or not on my local spotted page on Facebook. 90% of people voted I should still go out and clean Windows. We're in self isolation at the minute until next Monday - then I'm going out. But I'll be doing everything I can to keep everyone safe.

All the best!

Kind Regards,

Ken

 

[fast_muchly]

For those that understand the risks and need to work with the minimum amount of risk then I personally would do it this way. Have a bucket, with a lid, of diluted bleach in the van. Pull up at first job, put on gloves, remove bucket and wash gloves in bleach. Do job come back to van wash gloves in bucket outside of van. Reel hose in using a cloth soaked in a solution of bleach, put pole away and rinse gloves. Put bucket in back of van close door and move to next job, with or without gloves on, repeat. If anyone can constructively pull holes in this please do so as this is aimed at making it safer for everyone and not to cause an argument. 

Agreed part timer 

But I will start pulling holes 

The problem with people going back like this is more and more are encouraged to go back ( EXACTLY WHAT IS HAPPENING ) and then we get the real retards going back that accept having coffees post it on FB and think its funny  , you see where im going with this .

Also your guidelines are brilliant I can only add to this 1 thing which is slim chance of happening I agree but if you put your newly disinfected gloves on a contact point that is infected your then put it on any other contact point around the house that your again then touch ………...unlikely I agree but its a chance isn't it .

Also come on be honest will every window cleaner ACTUALLY DO THAT EVERY BLOODY TIME , no they wont will they , you know it part time and I know it ………….standards start to slip .

I don't get it 80% wages paid , if your not diddling the taxman and are putting correct figures in I really don't get why people who are elgible are working its absolute madness and totally crazy . 

I see peoples points who are not able to claim it hits them really hard and they should have given a blanket payment like Trump has done .

But at end of day whats better, dead, or working then dead, or working and killing someone else .Or not working at all claiming the 80% and just running the supermarket sweep we have to do because we have to, to get food .

 

[Part Timer]

Agreed part timer 

But I will start pulling holes 

The problem with people going back like this is more and more are encouraged to go back ( EXACTLY WHAT IS HAPPENING ) and then we get the real retards going back that accept having coffees post it on FB and think its funny  , you see where im going with this .

Also your guidelines are brilliant I can only add to this 1 thing which is slim chance of happening I agree but if you put your newly disinfected gloves on a contact point that is infected your then put it on any other contact point around the house that your again then touch ………...unlikely I agree but its a chance isn't it .

Also come on be honest will every window cleaner ACTUALLY DO THAT EVERY BLOODY TIME , no they wont will they , you know it part time and I know it ………….standards start to slip .

I don't get it 80% wages paid , if your not diddling the taxman and are putting correct figures in I really don't get why people who are elgible are working its absolute madness and totally crazy . 

I see peoples points who are not able to claim it hits them really hard and they should have given a blanket payment like Trump has done .

But at end of day whats better, dead, or working then dead, or working and killing someone else .Or not working at all claiming the 80% and just running the supermarket sweep we have to do because we have to, to get food .

This was aimed at those that aren't entitled to any money and is meant to minimise the risk of contamination and cross contamination. I don't understand what is constructive in your post, I said it wasn't meant to cause an argument.

 

[fast_muchly]

I've been watching this thread for a while.

So I've asked should I work or not on my local spotted page on Facebook. 90% of people voted I should still go out and clean Windows. We're in self isolation at the minute until next Monday - then I'm going out. But I'll be doing everything I can to keep everyone safe.

All the best!

Kind Regards,

Ken

Ask again and explain to them this .

I cannot be sure if I have covid 19 or not as I have no proof .

Do you realise that if I do have it and I don't know , do you realise that I could infect part of your upvc for up to 3 days ….did you know this dear customer .

Are you o.k with me coming to work please .

Please post the results of your vote after this .

And lets not forget there are all sorts of level of intelligence sat at home right now , just look at people walking round that are far to close together still , and stil li ndenail of how serious this is