When will I learn?

[dmw]

So I've got a nice compact round in North Manchester, 6 streets a full week of nice tight work all good. A year ago the old customer died, good payer, nice attitude just the customer we like, so it's been empty for a year it's been sold and refurbed.

New people move in but I struggled catching them in to recommence cleaning if required.

Anyway I do next door either side to this house and both customers give me the heads up that they want doing ASAP, and next time round (last week) I cleaned them with the rest of the round, pretty dirty as they had been done about a year ago by my good self. and put the bill through the door as I still hadn't seen this couple.

I bet your all thinking now "he's not been paid has he?"

Well two days later check my account and I was paid the said amount. Happy days me thinks.

However a couple of day later I get a text from the customer. Here it is verbatim.

Hi Darren, this is Nicole from xxxxxstreet,

I just wanted to cancel the window cleaning

Service please. We may resume in the future

But currently don't require it at the minute.

Hope that's ok. Thank you for your help............

I bet many of you guys reading this and sucking the air through their teeth and shaking their head. Yes you're right I've been had over. Here's what I should have done (feel free to add)

1. I should have charged double for a first clean,I didn't because all the work was all lined up at a good ongoing price, I could soak it up

2. Waited till I had actually met the messers, most of us seasoned pros on here have the sixth sense and picked up on what these people are like and I wouldn't have set myself up for a fall.

I was tempted to give them a snotty rebuke by text, but I'm keeping my powder dry on this one, I'll leave it a few months and wait for the expected call and politely decline and tell them to find somebody else, and as mentioned on here "patches" don't exist however on this round I share information with a couple of other windies and we do tend to keep to our own areas and pass work onto each other, so this house will be on the radar. They may get someone, but it just makes it more difficult for them.

Anyway I've been doing this since 1991 and it's more of a lesson to the new guys on here of how not to run a Window Cleaning round and I should learn to listen to my own advice lol.

So I'm still trying to nurture the perfect round, but I don't think it actually exists, shifting sands etc

Sorry for the Essay!

Feel free to criticize, console or laugh at.[emoji1] [emoji27] [emoji87]

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[Dave Shaw]

So I've got a nice compact round in North Manchester, 6 streets a full week of nice tight work all good. A year ago the old customer died, good payer, nice attitude just the customer we like, so it's been empty for a year it's been sold and refurbed.
New people move in but I struggled catching them in to recommence cleaning if required.
Anyway I do next door either side to this house and both customers give me the heads up that they want doing ASAP, and next time round (last week) I cleaned them with the rest of the round, pretty dirty as they had been done about a year ago by my good self. and put the bill through the door as I still hadn't seen this couple.
I bet your all thinking now "he's not been paid has he?"
Well two days later check my account and I was paid the said amount. Happy days me thinks.
However a couple of day later I get a text from the customer. Here it is verbatim.
Hi Darren, this is Nicole from xxxxxstreet,
I just wanted to cancel the window cleaning
Service please. We may resume in the future
But currently don't require it at the minute.
Hope that's ok. Thank you for your help............
 
I bet many of you guys reading this and sucking the air through their teeth and shaking their head. Yes you're right I've been had over. Here's what I should have done (feel free to add)
1. I should have charged double for a first clean,I didn't because all the work was all lined up at a good ongoing price, I could soak it up
2. Waited till I had actually met the messers, most of us seasoned pros on here have the sixth sense and picked up on what these people are like and I wouldn't have set myself up for a fall.
 
I was tempted to give them a snotty rebuke by text, but I'm keeping my powder dry on this one, I'll leave it a few months and wait for the expected call and politely decline and tell them to find somebody else, and as mentioned on here "patches" don't exist however on this round I share information with a couple of other windies and we do tend to keep to our own areas and pass work onto each other, so this house will be on the radar. They may get someone, but it just makes it more difficult for them.
 
Anyway I've been doing this since 1991 and it's more of a lesson to the new guys on here of how not to run a Window Cleaning round and I should learn to listen to my own advice lol.
So I'm still trying to nurture the perfect round, but I don't think it actually exists, shifting sands etc
Sorry for the Essay!
Feel free to criticize, console or laugh at.[emoji1] [emoji27] [emoji87]
 
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It’s happened before and no doubt it’ll happen again. Just one of the annoying aspects of working with people.
Where about in Manchester are you based?
Used to do a bit of work over in new moston. Still do a nice little estate over in cheadle.


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[Iron Giant]

One answer GoCardless then you get no messers

County Durham Lad

 

[adamangler]

You are right though,  perfect round doesn't exist. Just when you think you've got rid of all Messer's another pops up.

No such thing.

 

[Dave Shaw]

One answer GoCardless then you get no messers

County Durham Lad

Written contract is what you was looking for. Even gocardless can’t stop people changing their minds and cancelling after a clean or two. At best it may just deter a few due to the mentality of signing up to something.


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[Iron Giant]

Written contract is what you was looking for. Even gocardless can’t stop people changing their minds and cancelling after a clean or two. At best it may just deter a few due to the mentality of signing up to something.


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Residential clients wouldn't sign a contract I've no doubt. Even commercial clients who claim they want a regular service can ditch you after a few cleans.

I have had 1 messer with GoCardless out of 100's in over 4 years of using GC

County Durham Lad

 

[Dave Shaw]

Residential clients wouldn't sign a contract I've no doubt. Even commercial clients who claim they want a regular service can ditch you after a few cleans.

I have had 1 messer with GoCardless out of 100's in over 4 years of using GC

County Durham Lad

They definitely wouldn’t but that’s the only way you would get no messers.
Out of curiosity how much would it cost me to process a batch payment of £1000 spread over 100 clients through gocardless?


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[dmw]

It’s happened before and no doubt it’ll happen again. Just one of the annoying aspects of working with people.
Where about in Manchester are you based?
Used to do a bit of work over in new moston. Still do a nice little estate over in cheadle.


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Hi Dave, I do mostly round Failsworth where the majority is then Chadderton, Shaw, a 5 mile radius of home roughly.

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One answer GoCardless then you get no messers

County Durham Lad

I'm still procrastinating over Gocardless, it is a big enough company to cope but always something at the back of my mind thinking they hold all the cards and can up their fees when it suits but it does cut out a lot of collecting.
And also it's down to me to get off my Harris and implement it.

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[Tuffers]

I'm asking myself if you've gone ahead and cleaned without getting actual confirmation from the new owners but the neighbours have said that the new people have said they want them cleaned. If so and you've been paid but they don't require a window cleaner I think you've not lost out really.

 

[scottish cleaning service]

The same happened to me and I got paid. In hindsight it is better to get their number and send a text stating price and frequency and they know where we all stand. Sounds like they are moving on once the house is done up, don't be surprised if a for sale board arrives outside their property.

 

[Iron Giant]

They definitely wouldn’t but that’s the only way you would get no messers.
Out of curiosity how much would it cost me to process a batch payment of £1000 spread over 100 clients through gocardless?


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£10.00 

 

[Iron Giant]

I'm still procrastinating over Gocardless, it is a big enough company to cope but always something at the back of my mind thinking they hold all the cards and can up their fees when it suits but it does cut out a lot of collecting.
And also it's down to me to get off my Harris and implement it.

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The point you raise was thrown up by lads over 4 years ago and the same ones still don't use GC and see it as pointless ?. In over 4 years I have saved my self 100's of hours by not doing cash collections and £1,000s in fuel and vehicle running costs, even if they hiked their fees up to 5% it would cost 50p on a £10.00 job 

 

[Green Pro Clean Ltd]

If I came home and saw a bill for window cleaning, lawn mowing, bin cleaning or whatever you'd be told to jog on if I hadn't asked you for it.  

'Oh your neighbour said you wanted it doing' 

Well you can ask the neighbour for payment. 

It's the equivilant of a chat over the fence with her next door and me saying 'I really must get that lawn mowed' and next thing she's had her gardner do it and bill me  

The fact that it needs doing is of no relevance.... the fact that you want ahead and did work on my property without my express request is the issue. 

'Keep your powder dry' all you like. At the end of the day you should be grateful she paid at all for a service she hadn't specifically contacted you for and sent you a text politely saying no for the future and not one reading you the riot act for taking a liberty. 

Why not just walk the streets cleaning any old dirty windows and popping bills in? See how you go? 

You got to be honest.  You know better than to do a job where you never even spoke to the customer to start with regardless of what the neighbours say @dmw

Hope it's lesson learnt mate. 

 

[dmw]

If I came home and saw a bill for window cleaning, lawn mowing, bin cleaning or whatever you'd be told to jog on if I hadn't asked you for it.  
 
'Oh your neighbour said you wanted it doing' 
 
Well you can ask the neighbour for payment. 
 
It's the equivilant of a chat over the fence with her next door and me saying 'I really must get that lawn mowed' and next thing she's had her gardner do it and bill me  
 
The fact that it needs doing is of no relevance.... the fact that you want ahead and did work on my property without my express request is the issue. 
 
'Keep your powder dry' all you like. At the end of the day you should be grateful she paid at all for a service she hadn't specifically contacted you for and sent you a text politely saying no for the future and not one reading you the riot act for taking a liberty. 
 
Why not just walk the streets cleaning any old dirty windows and popping bills in? See how you go? 
 
You got to be honest.  You know better than to do a job where you never even spoke to the customer to start with regardless of what the neighbours say [mention=3988]dmw[/mention]
 
Hope it's lesson learnt mate. 

Yes lesson learnt Darren. But the house holder specifically asked both neighbours either side to ask me to clean them when they saw me so I've hardly imposed my services upon them.

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[Green Pro Clean Ltd]

Yes lesson learnt Darren. But the house holder specifically asked both neighbours either side to ask me to clean them when they saw me so I've hardly imposed my services upon them.

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If that's the case I would drop by and introduce myself, see if you can't get her back on.  

Whilst she may well have asked the neighbour to sort it did the neighbours explain your pricing structure, prices for 4 weekly or 8 weekly, first clean surcharge, one off premiums etc.......? Doubtful.  

Without a direct conversation to start you left yourself wide open mate  

 

[adamangler]

I think you took a gamble .

Sometimes you win sometimes you lose.

I did exactly what you did about a year ago.

Cleaned the next door on her day so, she had actually asked her to ask me and she had agreed to the price.

However once I cleaned it I asked for payment and she said I can't pay online you'll have to collect.

So I had to go collect my money on an evening, something I don't do wasting fuel and then had to drop her anyway as she refused to pay online.

It was my fault.

I think you were lucky you got paid, I've lost count of the jobs which I never got paid from. 

 

[Bumblebee72]

I'm with Green Pro et al on this.  The customers probably don't even realise they've caused offence.  They asked the neighbours to get you to clean their windows and afterwards they paid you.

Contract accepted and completed.

No further conditions were expressed or implied - if you wanted to impose conditions ("I only do regular etc...) these should have been stated and agreed before the work was undertaken.

Not everyone instinctively understands the mechanics of a window cleaning service.

 

[P4dstar]

Yes lesson learnt Darren. But the house holder specifically asked both neighbours either side to ask me to clean them when they saw me so I've hardly imposed my services upon them.

Thing is now they have your number and can contact you directly. I agree with @Tuffers and @Green Pro Clean Ltd mate, you got lucky here.

Personally I wouldn't say no if she calls, I would have a conversation about first clean surcharges. I would explain that cleaning her windows takes a lot more effort than doing Dave and Bob either side which is why you charge more. If you have a monopoly on that street you should keep her onside incase another windy rocks up and you loose more customers.

I'll just give you an example, I picked up a customer this week because her friend booked me last week. Made her start thinking about her own windy and the job he was doing. In fairness he is trad and he keeps missing the corners, when I turned up to do the quote her neighbours started twitching the curtains and I picked up 2 more, all from the same windy. I'm just thinking the domino effect and not assuming they would have issues with your workmanship. They paid, they're not out of your way, I genuinely wouldn't drop that one!

 

[dmw]

Thing is now they have your number and can contact you directly. I agree with [mention=196]Tuffers[/mention] and [mention=1930]Green Pro Clean Ltd[/mention] mate, you got lucky here.
 
Personally I wouldn't say no if she calls, I would have a conversation about first clean surcharges. I would explain that cleaning her windows takes a lot more effort than doing Dave and Bob either side which is why you charge more. If you have a monopoly on that street you should keep her onside incase another windy rocks up and you loose more customers.
 
I'll just give you an example, I picked up a customer this week because her friend booked me last week. Made her start thinking about her own windy and the job he was doing. In fairness he is trad and he keeps missing the corners, when I turned up to do the quote her neighbours started twitching the curtains and I picked up 2 more, all from the same windy. I'm just thinking the domino effect and not assuming they would have issues with your workmanship. They paid, they're not out of your way, I genuinely wouldn't drop that one!

In hindsight perhaps I've been a bit disingenuous to the householders, from what I can gather they're young first time buyers so perhaps they don't know how the business works.
I never did reply to the text they sent me, so I can explain about one offs, maintenance cleans etc. the next time I see them and go from there.

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[P4dstar]

In hindsight perhaps I've been a bit disingenuous to the householders, from what I can gather they're young first time buyers so perhaps they don't know how the business works.
I never did reply to the text they sent me, so I can explain about one offs, maintenance cleans etc. the next time I see them and go from there.

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A lot of it comes from what their parents did. I moved around a lot in my 20s and the one time I went for a mortgage the windys I rang never turned up for their quotes. When I moved to my current house with the wife she got a guy round and I was shocked that he wanted to come every 6 weeks, when I was a kid my mums windy came religiously every fortnight so I thought it was a weekly or fortnightly thing.

If the customers who recommended you asks about them then just explain they didn’t want it regularly like they do. Might be worth politely saying how you won’t be able to give them the discounts you give to your regulars in the future so they know before they recommend you again? Especially if they aren’t in most of the time and you may not get to have this conversation yourself.

 

[dmw]

A lot of it comes from what their parents did. I moved around a lot in my 20s and the one time I went for a mortgage the windys I rang never turned up for their quotes. When I moved to my current house with the wife she got a guy round and I was shocked that he wanted to come every 6 weeks, when I was a kid my mums windy came religiously every fortnight so I thought it was a weekly or fortnightly thing.
 
If the customers who recommended you asks about them then just explain they didn’t want it regularly like they do. Might be worth politely saying how you won’t be able to give them the discounts you give to your regulars in the future so they know before they recommend you again? Especially if they aren’t in most of the time and you may not get to have this conversation yourself.

On this round and still for most of the area the vast majority are still fortnightly and some window cleaners won't accept longer frequencies, my diary's pretty full and I'm doing a lot more monthlies for a higher price, because let's be truthful they're not much dirtier.

On that same road at the end of last year I had request for a one off as they had spent a shedload renovating their house and didn't have much money (I appreciated their honesty) in the end I talked them in to a 12 weekly for extra and they have been really happy with it.
This job is changing all the time and we've all got to adapt or be left behind, I suppose.

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