Jump to content
fast_muchly

Damage to very old wall



Recommended Posts

fast_muchly

Hi 

         Clean an old ladys bungalow this is the 3rd time of doing it and she is losing it abit and cant get around ( just painting the picture ) .

         She usually gives me the key to do around the back to undo the wrought iron gate ( padlocked ) . But this time she said she couldn't because she wasn't very mobile and feeling unwell . I said I can get over with the ladders its o.k . She said that's fine .

 

       So I pop the ladders against the wall end which is at the side of the gate its a 4x4 brick . I go up the ladders and stand on top of the wallend and lift the ladders up and pop them down the other side against the wrought iron gate . Once im down there is a very small single brick wall running in opposite direction  and about 4 foot in length about shoulder high which contains those cement see through patterned bricks . All I did and this is honestly what happened was moved my ladders against this wall and the whole top section of the wall went over in one block and fell on a plastic chair the other side and destroyed it. 

 

I went in told the lady and insisted on contacting a member of her family as I think she might be a bit confused to say what had happened and just let them know as I didn't want her relaying the info as I wouldn't rely on it being remembered as straight as I told her .

 

Well about a week and a half has past I have forgot all about it and ive just been rung by this said old little lady . Basically saying she has contacted her insurance and what am I going to do about it being repaired .

 

Im sorry but I don't see this as being my fault and I should not have to pay a thing . This wall has been up years and is thin single brick but surely any wall should stand an aluminium ladder leaning against it and not capsizing ??? . Its your typical old ladies bungalow going into slow decline . 

 

If I had leaned my ladders against a wall and the wind blew it over and it hit her car . That is my fault as that's bad placement of ladders .

 

Where do I stand with this legally as I do not have insurance .

Plus im peed off she has been to other neighbours saying whats happened so now im refusing to pay im worried there going to think bad of me as they have all said what a great bloke I am and I will sort it . Normally I would but in this instance I really think the wall was in a terrible state and what if it had fell on me ??? .

 

And NO I didn't walk on the wall at all just for people thinking this didnt happen as I said .

Edited by fast_muchly

Share this post


Link to post
Incheck

Its unfortunate. The idea is to try and not get yourself in these situations to start with, if she said im feeling unwell or whatever i would’ve just skipped it to be honest. The Number of mishaps as a result of “gate hopping” is why we ask for them to be left open. It is her responsibility to maintain the wall and yes you could have really been hurt. 🤷‍♂️ dont know what to say really. Happens all too often...turn up for a window clean, next thing you know you’re replacing god knows what. Maybe tell her to phone your insurance company and take it up with them? That’s what they’re there for. I don’t imagine they’d pay out for it...


Sent using the Window Cleaning Forums mobile app

Share this post


Link to post
Pied Piper
22 minutes ago, fast_muchly said:

Im sorry but I don't see this as being my fault and I should not have to pay a thing . This wall has been up years and is thin single brick but surely any wall should stand an aluminium ladder leaning against it and not capsizing ??? . Its your typical old ladies bungalow going into slow decline . 

 

Did you risk assess it ?  can you imagine if it had come down on top of you , me personally once the old lady said she couldn't open the gate I would have cleaned the front and charged he accordingly then walked away until next clean in this day and age its not worth putting yourself out for people because if it dose go wrong they are very quick with the blame game.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
jason20581

You don’t have insurance?? May I ask why you don’t have insurance?


Sent from my iPhone using Window Cleaning Forums

Share this post


Link to post
Big sul
You don’t have insurance?? May I ask why you don’t have insurance?


Sent from my iPhone using Window Cleaning Forums
Yep I've got to agree!
Why don't you have insurance???
For the couple of ££s it costs your coverd for this kind of accident.

Sent using the Window Cleaning Forums mobile app

Share this post


Link to post
Pied Piper

As Incheck says above I doubt very much that your insurance will payout, have you not got a mate that could mix some cement up and repair the wall, It will be cheaper than anyone she will get in.

Failing that a bunch of flowers works wonders LOL.

Share this post


Link to post
Incheck
As Incheck says above I doubt very much that your insurance will payout, have you not got a mate that could mix some cement up and repair the wall, It will be cheaper than anyone she will get in.
Failing that a bunch of flowers works wonders LOL.

As pointed out above - no insurance 🤷‍♂️


Sent using the Window Cleaning Forums mobile app

Share this post


Link to post
Pied Piper
1 minute ago, Incheck said:


As pointed out above - no insurance 🤷‍♂️


Sent using the Window Cleaning Forums mobile app

 

Looks like it could be the flowers then LOL.

 

You can not offer a service these days without covering your ass with some sort of insurance.

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Pjj

Unfortunately you did cause the damage , you have just got to look big and pay  up end of , just look at it that all the money you have saved for not having insurance for ?.... how ever many years will pay for the repairs , not ideal but that’s all you can do 

Share this post


Link to post
Green Pro Clean Ltd
7 hours ago, fast_muchly said:

Where do I stand with this legally as I do not have insurance

 

No idea where you stand. 

 

The law states clearly that liability insurance is compulsory but hey you saved yourself £150 per year by not bothering to get any so that's a result! 👍

Share this post


Link to post
ks789

yeh and as matey said further up, get a mate whose handy to do it if poss. not too tricky to knock up some cement and do a top layer/course. as for the plastic chair, buy a set for £20, give her one and keep the rest.  actually re-reading that dont sound right but, guess its an option lol.😄 im off lads, work morning, ta ta.

Share this post


Link to post
Green Pro Clean Ltd
32 minutes ago, dmw said:

But it may be prudent to get insured in future.

 

It's not prudent, it's a legal requirement.  

Share this post


Link to post
Redditch windy
 
No idea where you stand. 
 
The law states clearly that liability insurance is compulsory but hey you saved yourself £150 per year by not bothering to get any so that's a result! [emoji106]
is that a law applicable to ltd companies only or sole traders too? although he should have ins in either case

Sent using the Window Cleaning Forums mobile app

Share this post


Link to post
Part Timer
5 minutes ago, Redditch windy said:

is that a law applicable to ltd companies only or sole traders too? although he should have ins in either case

Sent using the Window Cleaning Forums mobile app
 

It isn't a legal requirement, best to get this confirmed, but it makes sense as not having it potentially exposes you to massive liabilities 

Share this post


Link to post
Incheck
It isn't a legal requirement, best to get this confirmed, but it makes sense as not having it potentially exposes you to massive liabilities 

Yeah, if you google it, its pretty clearly stated in various places that it isn’t mandatory. But as you say, it makes sense.
However, if you employ, it is a legal requirement to have employers liability insurance, from what i can gather anyway.


Sent using the Window Cleaning Forums mobile app

Share this post


Link to post
Incheck

The property owner is liable to a certain degree for the safety of people who work on their property i believe. This has been covered before (i think) as regards people working on ladders, people who stand on high window sills etc etc. E.g. i dare say a hotel owner could get in big trouble for allowing someone to balance on a 3rd floor window sill to clean a window.
This being an eighty year old pensioners deteriorated wall i understand the matter is a different scenario, but
say if the wall had collapsed on top of you and the result was you broke a hip and fractured a few ribs then people might take a different view of this and sympathise i don’t know. Forgive me if i’m wrong but blame seems to favour the person who presumably comes off the worst?
I may be going to deep for sense here i dont know


Sent using the Window Cleaning Forums mobile app

Share this post


Link to post
Skxawng

It's difficult as the wall would probably be up still if you hadn't been but if a wall can't have a ladder leant against it then it's obviously in a state of disrepair. Those screen block walls are notoriously unstable anyway.

I'd explain that the wall was in very bad condition and that you'd contribute half to get it sorted out to a better condition than it was before. 

But yeah lesson learned. Even cheap insurance will cover damage to property like that. I've got it for £40 this year.

Share this post


Link to post
THL4KEL

I've got a customer who has a wall that's ready to collapse... I had to climb over it a few months back she had gone out and forgot I was coming. Very glad I noticed it was ready to come down ended up going over the neighbours wall..

Share this post


Link to post
rugbywolf

I sympathy with you fast_muchly, but your lesson has been learnt now;  never go near a single brick wall. I would advise you not to rebuild it like some on here have said, unless you are qualified to do so, in case it falls down again in the future, and where will you stand then.

Edited by rugbywolf
misspelling

Share this post


Link to post
Dave B

Not sure on this one

The way the law is means that if you were to fall off a ladder working on a customers property you can legally sue the customer (although we wouldn't) as they have a duty to know how you are doing the job and are agreeing to it

Not sure about the broken wall though

 

This is why I have £5m liability cover though

£1m is about 14 quid a month through gleaming though and covers a very comprehensive amount of circumstances so well worth paying for

Share this post


Link to post
scottish cleaning service

I would just rebuild the bit I broke or get someone else to build it and pay the bill. The wind would have probably blown it over in the fullness of time. I don't think her home insurance covers fences or walls but I may be wrong.

Share this post


Link to post
rugbywolf
On ‎13‎/‎11‎/‎2018 at 15:37, Dave B said:

Not sure on this one

The way the law is means that if you were to fall off a ladder working on a customers property you can legally sue the customer (although we wouldn't) as they have a duty to know how you are doing the job and are agreeing to it

Not sure about the broken wall though

 

This is why I have £5m liability cover though

£1m is about 14 quid a month through gleaming though and covers a very comprehensive amount of circumstances so well worth paying for

I think it goes like this; the customer has invited you on to their property to do the work, therefore if you get injured or something gets damaged, then it is then customer' s responsibility to make sure that it is safe etc. In this case of the single wall, the owners could argue that you didn't have permission to go on that wall, so you contributed to the damage, as I think someone has already pointed out. So if it was me, I would bite the bullet and offer to go halves, but only as far as putting it back to how it was.

Share this post


Link to post
monkeyman12
I think it goes like this; the customer has invited you on to their property to do the work, therefore if you get injured or something gets damaged, then it is then customer' s responsibility to make sure that it is safe etc. In this case of the single wall, the owners could argue that you didn't have permission to go on that wall, so you contributed to the damage, as I think someone has already pointed out. So if it was me, I would bite the bullet and offer to go halves, but only as far as putting it back to how it was.

He didn't go on the wall that fell down. He merely put his ladders up against it,and it fell down.

I see it like this,if the wall was knackered,and it fell down just because ladders were lent against it,then it ain't your fault. If you walked on it,and it fell down,then there's an argument that it is your fault.

I've got a customer who has had one hinge holding the gate on for months, she's aware of it too. Now if I go through the gate,and it falls off its one remaining hinge,then am I responsible?

No. If I did something stupid like trying to vault it,and it then broke,then maybe I am responsible.

Same as if the chap here had walked on the wall,or charged at it with his ladders,in a bizarre medieval jousting reenactment, then I'd say he's responsible.

But leaning his ladders against it,and it falling down.....nah!

 

Sent using the Window Cleaning Forums mobile app

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.