Hot water fix…*update*

[TimsScrims]

Ive spoken to about 3/4 hot water engineers that deal with webasto units, none of them local surprise surprise. Anyway most logical explanation for my blow up is that my coolant was supposed to be mixed 50/50 and should be a blue-ish colour, not lime green. In other words, it over heated and and blew, thanks to the guys at xline not advising me of this when they installed it. What im trying to decide is, its most likely my heat exchanger that is blown, so shall i try and drain the current coolant in the tank, replace the coolant with the right mix then replace the heat exchanger…or forget it and stop wasting my time (spent last wknd troubleshooting to no avail) and get an engineer to plug it in diagnose it and fix it professionally for double, or triple the price of a new heat exchanger or more?
Nearest webasto engineer to me is 5 hours away and cant do the job for another 1.5 months.

Im a bit of a noob with all this stuff and my confidence only goes so far. Ive posted original pic of what i found when i first opened the unit. First engineer i spoke to straight away said ‘your heat exchanger needs replaced’ he then quoted me £490+ Vat + fitting, when i looked online and i can get hold of one from a dealer for £350 new, so tried to rip me off, the problem with these engineers is they have the monopoly of it all cos they know not many are about especially in scotland.

I have since being to a local plumbers shop and replaced that broken flexi hose and re fitted, surprise to say that didnt work. Which i guess it wouldnt with neat coolant and a possible broken heat exchanger.
My issue is aswell, because it blew with a bang and big puff of smoke came out exhaust, i dont know if any damage has been done to other parts aswell, or clogged up other hoses etc so knowing my luck even if i replaced heat exchanger it may still not work.

I was quoted £870+ vat to replace the parts ie heat exchanger and the thermo top Evo etc, minus the electrics and pipes etc, for ‘plug n play’ and could be delivered. Unsure whether to go down that road either, or whether to go through the process of elimination first and start with the plate first. All pros and cons.
If i bought the new thermo top and heat exchanger etc at least i know its all new but then how would i know if the current thermo top is broken lol.

So just starting to get fed up with it all now, so good advice always welcome!

 

[Pjj]

Replace the flexi pipe and re set the heater try turning it on then if it doesn’t fire up remove the fuse leave it out for a couple of muinits replace the fuse turn it on again this will sometimes re set the fault codes , most heaters have a flashing light that will tell you the codes . If you were nearer I would take a look for you but it’s to far away You could try phoning x line and ask there advice , it’s only going to be a simple thing ime sure of that . The heat exchanger ime sure is fine it all looks brand new

 

[TimsScrims]

Ive replaced the flexi pipe, and ive also done the fuse reset many times but its all dead, when all plugged in water from water tank just flows through it. Flat as a pancake.
Yes it all looks new cos its hardly been used. I think the whole problem all along has been the wrong ratio of coolant and overheating issue.
Xline arent very helpful, ive spoken to them on phone and email but theyre too busy to reply.

This particular unit does not have fault codes or flashing lights.

Ive tried as follows:
1) resetting several times ejecting the fuses
2) charging leisure battery (in case a power issue)
3) connecting only cables linking controller (v11) and webasto unit to battery
4) replacing flexi hose

The other thing i could do which is the next cheap alternative is buy fuse replacements in case the fuses are dead (dont look burnt out)
Drain the coolant and put right mix in there then see if that works? But im guessing it wont be it.

The bang i heard when it broke down was quite significant and a big puff of white smoke, that came from the actual burner as the exhaust is connected to it, so im guessing probably some damage has been done to the thermo top evo aswell (?)

 

[Pjj]

Ive replaced the flexi pipe, and ive also done the fuse reset many times but its all dead, when all plugged in water from water tank just flows through it. Flat as a pancake.
Yes it all looks new cos its hardly been used. I think the whole problem all along has been the wrong ratio of coolant and overheating issue.
Xline arent very helpful, ive spoken to them on phone and email but theyre too busy to reply.

This particular unit does not have fault codes or flashing lights.

Ive tried as follows:
1) resetting several times ejecting the fuses
2) charging leisure battery (in case a power issue)
3) connecting only cables linking controller (v11) and webasto unit to battery
4) replacing flexi hose

The other thing i could do which is the next cheap alternative is buy fuse replacements in case the fuses are dead (dont look burnt out)
Drain the coolant and put right mix in there then see if that works? But im guessing it wont be it.

The bang i heard when it broke down was quite significant and a big puff of white smoke, that came from the actual burner as the exhaust is connected to it, so im guessing probably some damage has been done to the thermo top evo aswell (?)

Even with no anti freeze in the system it will still work fine , a 50/50 solution is what I run in mine it just stops a build up of rust and blocking the heat exchangers. If it overheats it will just shut down it shouldn’t blow up I think the bang was the hose going . The only other option is to get it plugged into diagnostics , they aren’t that complicated to be honest , have you tried boat yards and some commercial vehicle garages this type of thing is in trucks and motor homes for night heaters , I would have thought there must be someone near you that could sort it out , they are expensive on parts I must admit .

 

[ched999uk]

The heat exchanger is just 2 radiators connected together, so the fluid (antifreeze and water) in the thermotop side is heated by the diesel and passed through 1 side of the heat exchanger which heats your pure as that flows in the other side of the heat exchanger. It's just a mechanical device with no moving parts, so if your pure is still coming out pure and no fluids are leaking it's probably perfect. My guess for the hose snapping was an over temp causing high temps and pressure that blew it - or it was twisted on install and that contributed to the pipe failing.
The only reason far a heat exchanger is because your pure wouldn't be safe to pass round the thermotop as it has no corrosion inhibitor or antifreeze in (most antifreeze has corrosion inhibitor in).
What ever the ratio of antifreeze to water I can't imagine it doing any damage to the combustion site of the thermotop. As for colour of the antifreeze, I believe they are tacking the mickey saying that that is the issue - it's normally just different manufacturers or slightly different additives that are used and then it's dyed a colour of the manufacturers choosing - years ago the colour signified they type of antifreeze but nowadays I believe the colour has no relevance.

I would say it needs connecting to a Thermotop diagnostic machine as I think it overheated and probably burnt through the combustion chamber, the jet was partially blocked causing a hot spot or the temperature sensor failed causing high temps.
Try looking on canal boat forums or motorhome ones and asking if anyone knows a Webasto service engineer near you.

 

[Mark Staton]

The heat exchanger is just 2 radiators connected together, so the fluid (antifreeze and water) in the thermotop side is heated by the diesel and passed through 1 side of the heat exchanger which heats your pure as that flows in the other side of the heat exchanger. It's just a mechanical device with no moving parts, so if your pure is still coming out pure and no fluids are leaking it's probably perfect. My guess for the hose snapping was an over temp causing high temps and pressure that blew it - or it was twisted on install and that contributed to the pipe failing.
The only reason far a heat exchanger is because your pure wouldn't be safe to pass round the thermotop as it has no corrosion inhibitor or antifreeze in (most antifreeze has corrosion inhibitor in).
What ever the ratio of antifreeze to water I can't imagine it doing any damage to the combustion site of the thermotop. As for colour of the antifreeze, I believe they are tacking the mickey saying that that is the issue - it's normally just different manufacturers or slightly different additives that are used and then it's dyed a colour of the manufacturers choosing - years ago the colour signified they type of antifreeze but nowadays I believe the colour has no relevance.

I would say it needs connecting to a Thermotop diagnostic machine as I think it overheated and probably burnt through the combustion chamber, the jet was partially blocked causing a hot spot or the temperature sensor failed causing high temps.
Try looking on canal boat forums or motorhome ones and asking if anyone knows a Webasto service engineer near you.

Speak to this company they sell and repair units very knowledgeable they are called Mellor online 01924 274774

 

[TimsScrims]

Yep, all booked in with a webasto engineer end of July to get the full diagnostic and repair done. It will answer a lot of questions, so this will hopefully not happen again, i plan to pick the engineers brain so much he ll be glad to see the back of me.
Ive spoken To a few engineers and they have all contradicted each other or said different things, the most recent one i spoke to refused to point to anything and just simply said ‘bring your van down and we will diagnose the issue, then we can repair it’, black and white, and thats what i like, no messing. To be fair to the others though, it could actually be anything, but i need to get to the bottom of it so i can eliminate it happening again - just hoping its not going to empty my pockets too much. Theyll have the knowledge thats priceless with these units.

One thing xline systems should do for every hot water system they install is give the customer a school lesson on exactly how it works for people who havent used one before, how to maintain and go over some troubleshooting, why not? They charge enough! But do they even fully know or even want to?

If the system was 10 years old and had plenty of hourly use id prob just forget it and rip the unit out, clean van out downsize my 750 tank etc overhaul whole van setup and just stick to cold, but i spent nearly £4k on this one man unit and its only been used about 1000 hours or so, so its getting fixed.

Will update when this saga is resolved!

 

[spruce]

I've found PB Auto Electrics in mansfield to be very helpful. They also have a repair service.

 

[TimsScrims]

So im back with more evidence and diagnoses of what happened to my webasto hot water unit. Finally got a mobile engineer to come out an diagnose it. After a LOT of tinkering and mess...he opened up the webasto evo top and found some corroded electrical pins, and one was missing (must've broke off), so he has now taken it away to fix and service, so awaiting for refit and test. He wasn't entirely certain what caused it, it could have been anything. My guess is the condensation which accumulated from my van ceiling dripped on my unit or condensation build up in the unit itself (my van wasnt insulated at all or even ply lined) and over time went inside the evo top and corroded it. seems far fetched but I have no other explanation for why electrical pins INSIDE the evo top were corroded?! the plastic housing was protecting it, INSIDE the metal xline box. If anyone else has another other theorys please let me know, I really want to eliminate this costly mistake happening again.
Aside from that, the exhaust pipe and air flow pipe wasn't blocked at all, but the engineer said its best to replace the exhaust pipe once a year or so for obvious reasons.

slightly going on another topic here, but try and kill two birds. on same wave length of the hot water unit. So xline fitted my hot water system with 2 seperate 115ah leisure batterys. but the size of these batterys are not the traditional 110ah size, they're smaller. Can any of you hot water guys give me some advice on your hot water power setup? Ideally id like to just run 1 big leisure battery (up to 200ah) to power my hot water, power reel and pump...can this be done? this week im gutting out my van insulating it etc. and ive bought a 30amp victron charger to charge my leisure battery, will this set up be all that is needed, or will the hot water drain the main leisure battery too much? any advice greatly received!

 

[spruce]

So im back with more evidence and diagnoses of what happened to my webasto hot water unit. Finally got a mobile engineer to come out an diagnose it. After a LOT of tinkering and mess...he opened up the webasto evo top and found some corroded electrical pins, and one was missing (must've broke off), so he has now taken it away to fix and service, so awaiting for refit and test. He wasn't entirely certain what caused it, it could have been anything. My guess is the condensation which accumulated from my van ceiling dripped on my unit or condensation build up in the unit itself (my van wasnt insulated at all or even ply lined) and over time went inside the evo top and corroded it. seems far fetched but I have no other explanation for why electrical pins INSIDE the evo top were corroded?! the plastic housing was protecting it, INSIDE the metal xline box. If anyone else has another other theorys please let me know, I really want to eliminate this costly mistake happening again.
Aside from that, the exhaust pipe and air flow pipe wasn't blocked at all, but the engineer said its best to replace the exhaust pipe once a year or so for obvious reasons.

slightly going on another topic here, but try and kill two birds. on same wave length of the hot water unit. So xline fitted my hot water system with 2 seperate 115ah leisure batterys. but the size of these batterys are not the traditional 110ah size, they're smaller. Can any of you hot water guys give me some advice on your hot water power setup? Ideally id like to just run 1 big leisure battery (up to 200ah) to power my hot water, power reel and pump...can this be done? this week im gutting out my van insulating it etc. and ive bought a 30amp victron charger to charge my leisure battery, will this set up be all that is needed, or will the hot water drain the main leisure battery too much? any advice greatly received!

I'm running a Lifepo4 Fogstar lithium 105amp battery, purchased last November. It powers the diesel heater and 2 Shurflo pumps.
I have a Sterling b2b charger with a lithium profile setting, but also opted for a 20amp lithium 230v mains charger.
In winter, I need to bench charge the battery once a week.
This Fogstar battery has its own internal heating pad which the bms activates when the battery temp is below 5 degrees C. So at first, the alternator warms the battery with 10 amps, but we don't do enough mileage to fully recharge the battery when it's warmer and accepting a charge.

According to Fogstar, it's OK to let the battery drop to 40% dod before recharging it. A lead acid battery needs to be recharged asap after using it. I recharged mine every night as my Sterling b2b charger never fully recharged the leisure battery as we just don't do the mileage.

In fact, I have to bench charge my van's starter battery from time to time as well, and that's just recently been replaced. I did that with the old battery as well. The old battery was fitted at the factory, so lasted 11 years. It had all the Fiat markings on it.