Spilt charge relay

[spruce]

Where is the fuse box?

[media]

[/media]
Excuse his language

 

[spruce]

Ford Transit Forum • View topic - Fuse F63 location

Some photos of the fuse box in real life

I'm pretty sure its F46 listed as 12V 15amp in this book. Why they have a 7.5 amp fuse in there I don't know.

 

[Aqua-pure Portadown]

Do many of you use a spilt charge relay as oppose to having to bench charge your batteries? Im looking for a spilt charger and found this CAMPER VAN SELF SWITCHING, VOLTAGE SENSING SPLIT CHARGE RELAY KIT - 12V, 30 AMP
Anyone use it or know if it will do the job im after?

By looks of it it looks and sounds perfect but just want to be sure

tks

I had a split relay fitted approx 18 months ago ,I have never had to charge the battery since ,I would do approx 100 buisness miles and 50 private miles

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

 

[Aqua-pure Portadown]

Thanks for that info spruce most helpful
Yeah mine is an 04 LWB so I should have that wire you refer to which woulf be dead handy, the actual wire itself is it a loose end wire as in just ends and dosent connect to anything then you splice the ends and connect to spilt charger wiring?

I dont get by what you mean about having to use a fuse under the glove box, do these need to be fused to there? Can they not just be fused inline? Maybe im taking it up worng

Mine is fused in line and was done by a motor spark so I take it this should be OK

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[steve hawing]

Ah i get you now spruce cheers

Very handy job then in that case hardest part getting ply off and retrieving the cable without losing a figure lol

 

[windowsurfer]

Just had my tank fitted to van and using my trolley system pump and battery to pump the water, but want to get a split charger put in, I drive a 100 miles a day, so shouldnt have a problem with charging leisure battery. I phoned a auto electrics guy he said it would be £160-£170 plus VAT to fit it. So if I got this one as posted at start of thread I will have everything for the job? CAMPER VAN SELF SWITCHING, VOLTAGE SENSING SPLIT CHARGE RELAY KIT - 12V, 30 AMP

 

[spruce]

Just had my tank fitted to van and using my trolley system pump and battery to pump the water, but want to get a split charger put in, I drive a 100 miles a day, so shouldnt have a problem with charging leisure battery. I phoned a auto electrics guy he said it would be £160-£170 plus VAT to fit it. So if I got this one as posted at start of thread I will have everything for the job? CAMPER VAN SELF SWITCHING, VOLTAGE SENSING SPLIT CHARGE RELAY KIT - 12V, 30 AMP

For an Auto Electrician that would be no more than half an hours labour; an hour at the very most. There is so little to the job. Where do they get these labour prices from?

 

[tench0771]

can u fit a power up real to ur battory if its conected to a split charge relay?

 

[spruce]

I would check with the manufacturers and see what they suggest.

In theory there will be no issue with a VSR but I would fit one with a larger capacity. Durite and others do 140 amp units. 70/80 amp cabling will be ok with 50 amp fuses. Minimum battery I would expect to be 110 amp h capable of delivering the 30 amps the motor draws.

Of course you may need a battery to battery charger if you have a ecu controlled charging system on your van.

 

[tench0771]

blady hell spruce im baffeld lmfao i have a vivaro 2.0cdti i may get my wfp suplier to sort it i think virotech they should be able to wire it all in for me ! i dont mind paying out but just want it done rite

 

[spruce]

blady hell spruce im baffeld lmfao i have a vivaro 2.0cdti i may get my wfp suplier to sort it i think virotech they should be able to wire it all in for me ! i dont mind paying out but just want it done rite

@tench0771 I'm afraid we have to be more careful with recommendations with regard to split charge relay or voltage sensing relays these days.

If you have a vehicle with a 'smart' alternator (as a rule of thumb this applies to vehicles with Euro 5 or 6 compliant engines onwards) the split charging methods outlined above won't be suitable and you'll need to use a battery to battery charger instead. But these units aren't cheap.

This website has a wealth of information.

Sterling Power Battery To Battery Chargers - | 12 Volt Planet

Sterling are the Rolls Royce of battery to battery chargers. But as demand grows other manufacturers will start producing these and competition will reduce pricing.

Ring RSCDC30 DC To DC Smart Battery Charger 30amp

I've done a quick search on Ebay and I have honestly never seen Sterling products on this site before. Numerous sellers now though.

 

[windowsurfer]

Eh what on earth was all that about, that's complicated stuff. I take it paying £170 is worth getting a garage to fit split charger is the route to take with this to ensure you don't do so.etching stupid.

Spruce are you saying the set up is:

Car battery

Split charger

Battery charger

Battery for pump? Thanks.

 

[spruce]

Eh what on earth was all that about, that's complicated stuff. I take it paying £170 is worth getting a garage to fit split charger is the route to take with this to ensure you don't do so.etching stupid.
Spruce are you saying the set up is:

Car battery

Split charger

Battery charger

Battery for pump? Thanks.

No @windowsurfer. If you have one of these new vans with a 'smart' alternator then the Battery to Battery charger replaces the SCR or VSR.

The issue comes because these vehicles need to meet new emissions regulations. The concept is that a vehicle battery (no longer a lead acid battery but a silver calcium battery) only needs to be about 80% fully charged. This leaves a 'space' of 20% to be charged when the vehicle is on overrun on a downhill or decelerating, for example. The ECU senses that the drivers foot is off the accelerator but the engine revs are high. So it kicks in the alternator to fast charge the battery. (A normal alternator peaks at 14.4 volts but these new alternators can produce a much high voltage output which charges the battery faster.) These may even be short pulses of charge. Kicking the alternator in under these conditions is also supposed to act as an engine brake (like an exhaust brake on a truck.)

So if you van's battery is at 90% charge, the alternator will not work normally. Because the alternator isn't working your discharged leisure battery won't receive a charge.

So a Battery to Battery charger actually draws current from the vehicle's battery, boosts it and then uses that current to charge the leisure battery even when the van's alternator isn't working. Once the sensors see that the van's battery has dropped to below 80% charge then it will kick the alternator in during normal running.

The concept behind this smart alternators is that under normal day time driving the engine shouldn't need engine power to fully charge the battery, hence a fuel saving.

The cheapest solution is to reprogram the ECU software to continually charge the battery. Unfortunately, as the manufacturers are held responsible for ensuring engine emissions compliance, this will never happen. So we have to buy an expensive work around.

I'm sure that there will be someone who will reprogram the software somewhere in the same way as remappers do. But it won't be manufacturer driven.

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[windowsurfer]

T

No @windowsurfer. If you have one of these new vans with a 'smart' alternator then the Battery to Battery charger replaces the SCR or VSR.
The issue comes because these vehicles need to meet new emissions regulations. The concept is that a vehicle battery (no longer a lead acid battery but a silver calcium battery) only needs to be about 80% fully charged. This leaves a 'space' of 20% to be charged when the vehicle is on overrun on a downhill or decelerating, for example. The ECU senses that the drivers foot is off the accelerator but the engine revs are high. So it kicks in the alternator to fast charge the battery. (A normal alternator peaks at 14.4 volts but these new alternators can produce a much high voltage output which charges the battery faster.) These may even be short pulses of charge. Kicking the alternator in under these conditions is also supposed to act as an engine brake (like an exhaust brake on a truck.)

So if you van's battery is at 90% charge, the alternator will not work normally. Because the alternator isn't working your discharged leisure battery won't receive a charge.

So a Battery to Battery charger actually draws current from the vehicle's battery, boosts it and then uses that current to charge the leisure battery even when the van's alternator isn't working. Once the sensors see that the van's battery has dropped to below 80% charge then it will kick the alternator in during normal running.

The concept behind this smart alternators is that under normal day time driving the engine shouldn't need engine power to fully charge the battery, hence a fuel saving.

The cheapest solution is to reprogram the ECU software to continually charge the battery. Unfortunately, as the manufacturers are held responsible for ensuring engine emissions compliance, this will never happen. So we have to buy an expensive work around.

I'm sure that there will be someone who will reprogram the software somewhere in the same way as remappers do. But it won't be manufacturer driven.

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Thank you for the explanation it was understandable, but I see it can be a big deal fitting the split charger.

I might get one of those spring controllers that tell you how much your battery is charged n just take it out n charge it when needed.

 

[WWC]

Windsurfer, Its not such a big deal if you have a normal battery and alternator. The Spring controller you are talking about is probably the one that I have. It charges your leisure battery too as it has a VSR built in. Yes, I understand wire it in the same way as a VSR - to the van's positive (with fuse) and negative terminals. Airing and instructions come with it. It's not difficult to wire up. Like any of these options, the hardest bit is running the wires from the van battery to the unit and keeping them safe/hidden for practical reasons. Mine runs behind the van's ply lining.

 

[dredge3]

You must fit a 140 amp VSR, with a 110 battery Split Charge Kits & Systems Products

 

[spruce]

You must fit a 140 amp VSR, with a 110 battery Split Charge Kits & Systems Products

But only if he has an older van like we do.

Someone who has a new Transit Customer says his solution is to switch the headlights on. What concerns me is the high charging voltages of these smart alternators. If a lead acid starter battery isn't suitable to be used then a lead acid leisure battery also won't tolerate those charging voltages either.

A battery to battery charger also will dampen the higher voltage to what a leisure battery prefers.

I bought my VSR from that supplier.

 

[windowsurfer]

From that link I now know what a VSR is- Voltage sensing relay. I have a Fiat doblo cargo SWB, "62" plate, if you are interested in working out what I need to do, that be great, if not no worries, I will wait til next month, as spent a fortune on buying cage and tank and fitting. and will think about it again.

 

[spruce]

From that link I now know what a VSR is- Voltage sensing relay. I have a Fiat doblo cargo SWB, "62" plate, if you are interested in working out what I need to do, that be great, if not no worries, I will wait til next month, as spent a fortune on buying cage and tank and fitting. and will think about it again.

What you need to do is decide where your VSR is to be fixed and how long the battery cable needs to be from you van battery to the leisure battery.

If you buy a kit you need to remember that the cable length is from battery to battery. So if your main run is 5 meters to the VSR (usually situated in the van where it's dry, then you need to order the 6 meter kit as the last meter is the 3 short pieces you will need. They are the short + from the starter battery to the fuse and then the 2 short lengths from the VSR to the fuse and the fuse to the leisure battery.

The VSR's we fitted to both single operator vans with 85 amph leisure batteries were 30 amp units. They have done nearly 5 years with one and 6 years with the other.

CAMPER VAN SELF SWITCHING, VOLTAGE SENSING SPLIT CHARGE RELAY KIT - 12V, 30 AMP

Unit with cables.

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[Duncs]

i,ve got the split relay but find it dies the death lunch time so i,ve got a slow charger bang it on every night to the 110 leasure battery

what a difference job done

 

[dredge3]

But only if he has an older van like we do.
Someone who has a new Transit Customer says his solution is to switch the headlights on. What concerns me is the high charging voltages of these smart alternators. If a lead acid starter battery isn't suitable to be used then a lead acid leisure battery also won't tolerate those charging voltages either.

A battery to battery charger also will dampen the higher voltage to what a leisure battery prefers.

I bought my VSR from that supplier.

Its not just what the alternator kicks out. I looked into it in detail. Mind blowing. If 1 battery if flat and the other full, the surge will be massive and blow the fuse. I thing small leisure batteries got away with it most of the time, But not 110amp batteries.

Its best fitting as close to main battery as poss. Less chance of problems. ! fuse as near main battery as poss and one as near leisure battery as pos.

If its really close 1 fuse would be ok.

I have a transit which is a 2 battery set up/ 1 main 1 aux via ford slit charge system. then I read about modern alternators etc and put it on hold. The more I looked into it, the more complicated it got. I will just put 1 in and see what happens