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Leisure Battery and Charger help/question


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Hello,

I need to buy a leisure battery and charger so that I can use a small 12 volt pump to pump water from my containers and tank into my backpack.

Would probably need to be used to pump water about 5 times a day, possibly a  but less - total of less than 100 litres a day (I only have a small round due to helping care for my Grandmother who is a long term cancer patient).

I have no idea what battery and charger would be best for me to buy.

Can any of you advise please?

Thanks very much.

 

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2 hours ago, wgwindows said:

Hello,

I need to buy a leisure battery and charger so that I can use a small 12 volt pump to pump water from my containers and tank into my backpack.

Would probably need to be used to pump water about 5 times a day, possibly a  but less - total of less than 100 litres a day (I only have a small round due to helping care for my Grandmother who is a long term cancer patient).

I have no idea what battery and charger would be best for me to buy.

Can any of you advise please?

Thanks very much.

 

My opinion based on my experience.

https://www.tayna.co.uk/leisure-batteries/numax/cxv24mf/

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Numax-12V-10A-Leisure-Battery-Charger-Caravan-Campervan-Motorhome-Marine-Boat/321156058628?hash=item4ac6648e04:g:lwcAAOxyGxxSKPSO

Whilst your day centers around your grandmother atm and you have a small round, this battery and charger would be suitable for a van mount with a Spring controller and HD Shurflo \\9or equivalent) wfp pump in the future if circumstances change.

Edited by spruce
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Thanks very much @spruce. Is this about the minimum I could use at the moment, or would it be ok for something for a bit lighter use. Just trying to minimise expenses at the moment. Thanks again.

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Hey Spruce - Tanya should pay you commission - I ordered a replacement system battery off the back of one of your previous posts - well priced arrived next day, installed the next day, back to work tomorrow 👍 

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31 minutes ago, wgwindows said:

Thanks very much @spruce. Is this about the minimum I could use at the moment, or would it be ok for something for a bit lighter use. Just trying to minimise expenses at the moment. Thanks again.

Yes you probably could. You could search for a golf cart trolley battery but they aren't much cheaper. You would also have to reduce the size of your charger and modify it to suit.

https://gardinerpolesystems.co.uk/all-products/pure-water-systems/portable-systems/backpack-spares-v3/backpack-battery-12v-12ah.html

https://gardinerpolesystems.co.uk/all-products/pure-water-systems/portable-systems/backpack-spares-v3/backpack-charger-240v-uk-plug.html

You would have to cut the plug off of the charger and replace it with a Torberry Anderson 30amp plug set.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/20-X-ANDERSON-POWERPOLE-30AMP-ELECTRICAL-CONNECTOR-PLUG-GOLF-TROLLEY-MOBILITY/140906405729?epid=1923022171&hash=item20cead1f61:g:sLwAAMXQUY1Q9Smb

You would have to wire up cable that would fix to the battery with 1/4" spade terminals. You would then put the same terminals onto the end of your cable to your pump.

So you would use the same socket to plug in the charger as you would to plug in the pump.

I would spend the extra money on a more versatile option as there would be very little you could do with this charger and battery in the future when you grow your business.

Edited by spruce
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7 minutes ago, NoName said:

Hey Spruce - Tanya should pay you commission - I ordered a replacement system battery off the back of one of your previous posts - well priced arrived next day, installed the next day, back to work tomorrow 👍 

👍

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1 hour ago, spruce said:

👍

spruce  how do I check if I have a bad battery ?  mine is 110 ah from Tanya  - about 2 years old  . It shows 12.8 when charged and after about half a day drops to 12.5 12.4 v 

i d like  to do a troubleshooting of my system  to find out what's wrong  as still can't get  enough flow with the controller at 40 . 

I have changed the reel with a new 8mm hose , changed also the hose from the tank to the pump ( just in case had something inside ) , I changed the pump too and the controller and thought the problem might be the battery ? I can check the voltage with a multimeter but can't check the amps cos the multimeter fuse needs to be replaced and is not a simple fuse 

Need to get everything sorted asap and not sure where to look to solve the issue with the flow 

with the controller at 40 ( calibrated at 43 ) the flow is very bad and after turning the valve off it will continue to pump forever before DE stop  however if i kink the hose between the pump and the reel the pump stops instantly 

 

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Lurie, I fiited a tanya one just today - mine had a sight 'hole' with a green (ok) black (dead) or white (needs charging) window on top inbetween the terminals  - mine was 'black' failed last Thurs on the job...had to run the van to finish...worth taking a look ….q Spruce with a nerdy answer 🤓 

Edited by NoName
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5 minutes ago, NoName said:

Lurie, I fiited a tanya one just today - mine had a sight 'hole' with a green (ok) black (dead) or white (needs charging) window on top inbetween the terminals  - mine was 'black' failed last Thurs on the job...had to run the van to finish...worth taking a look ….q Spruce with a nerdy answer 🤓 

shows green and the voltage is also acceptable but  what if it shows the voltage but it actually doesn't have the power / amps ?  or is the power direct proportional with the voltage 

sorry as an electrician  i can't get any worse - I can only check the voltage with a multimeter 

Edited by Iurie
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51 minutes ago, Iurie said:

spruce  how do I check if I have a bad battery ?  mine is 110 ah from Tanya  - about 2 years old  . It shows 12.8 when charged and after about half a day drops to 12.5 12.4 v 

i d like  to do a troubleshooting of my system  to find out what's wrong  as still can't get  enough flow with the controller at 40 . 

I have changed the reel with a new 8mm hose , changed also the hose from the tank to the pump ( just in case had something inside ) , I changed the pump too and the controller and thought the problem might be the battery ? I can check the voltage with a multimeter but can't check the amps cos the multimeter fuse needs to be replaced and is not a simple fuse 

Need to get everything sorted asap and not sure where to look to solve the issue with the flow 

with the controller at 40 ( calibrated at 43 ) the flow is very bad and after turning the valve off it will continue to pump forever before DE stop  however if i kink the hose between the pump and the reel the pump stops instantly 

 

Firstly, to get an accurate state of charge of your battery you need to have let the battery fully rest for around 4 hours. This is the amount of time you need for the voltage to stabilise.

If a battery reads 12.8 volts and above after this rest period its fully charged.

If its reading 12.5 volts after rest it 75% charged.

If its reading 12.4 volts after rest then its 50% charged. If you are measuring the voltage after half a day then your won't have an idea of the state of the battery's charge because it needs to rest. The battery will recover and show a higher voltage. If it recovers by 0.1 volt then its now 75% charged.

Identifying battery issues isn't straight forward tbh. But if everything starts off working fine at the beginning of the day then by process of elimination the only bit of equipment to focus on is the battery.

They are apparently able to test the performance of a starter battery with a new fancy digital test meter that uses a fancy algorithm to determine a battery's performance. But this test doesn't work for a leisure battery.

A sales outlet (motor factor, leisure center) will usually find a faulty battery as they will want to sell you a new one.

In the old days we used to unscrew the caps of a battery and check the water level. Then we used to put the battery on a long charge until fully charged and check inside for any bubbles in the battery cells. We then used to put a heavy load on it for a period of time and see if the battery would hold up. We also used to check for bubbles again to identify a bad cell.

This is even more difficult with a maintenance free leisure battery. Leisure batteries also don't like a heavy load applied to them. In this case we would put a load on the battery and see what happens. For example a 110 amp battery should in theory run a 10amp load for 11 hours.

Over time a battery can loose capacity due to sulphation of the plates. So your 110 amp battery could only have a capacity of 55amps. If you adhere to the 50% rule then you only have a battery capable of supplying 27 amps.

If you wire your controller up to the vans starter battery and it runs OK through the day then there is a problem with the leisure battery.

IMHO you should have a reasonable flow at the brush head at 40.

First thing to check is your pump's filter bowl and clean it out. Do you have a partially closed stop valve on the tank's outlet. Is the tanks vent breathing properly?

What you need to do is uncoil all 100 meters of hose on your reel. You need to be looking for kinks and twists in the hose that can restrict flow.

If you have a van port and use stop connectors check that they are opening properly. I won't use stop connectors any longer. Then look at the stop connector on the hose to your hose reel.

If DE happens immediately you kink the hose between the pump and the reel then the problem is after that. We have heard of delamination of the hose inside walls causing a restriction. This could be caused by poor hose manufacture or vehicles running across it in the road. We had a driver stop on our hose once and turn his wheels full lock.

Easy way to tell is if you have a second hose reel or you know a fellow windie who will allow you to try his.

 

Edited by spruce
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9 minutes ago, spruce said:

after turning the valve off it will continue to pump forever before DE stop  however if i kink the hose between the pump and the reel the pump stops instantly 

Which valve? Univalve? Tank valve? If you are turning water supply off TO the pump then it would take forever to DE?

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1 minute ago, Stevieboy said:

Which valve? Univalve? Tank valve? If you are turning water supply off TO the pump then it would take forever to DE?

Sorry i meant the pole valve - a simple on/off valve 

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Tank valve is always open , the pump isn't fitted with a filter , previous pump workd 8 years with no filter . 

I will chexk the tank lid to see if air goes in as it should 

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1 minute ago, Iurie said:

Sorry i meant the pole valve - a simple on/off valve 

Its a process in elimination. We use EZ snap hose to pole hose connectors. I usually have a spare male connector on board. If I plug that it I can see the flow out of the hose reel hose before the pole.

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2 minutes ago, spruce said:

Its a process in elimination. We use EZ snap hose to pole hose connectors. I usually have a spare male connector on board. If I plug that it I can see the flow out of the hose reel hose before the pole.

great idea  - i think i also have a spare male connector and will wire up the system to van battery and leave the flow open before the pole for a 5 min  that  should get the air out if any 

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8 hours ago, Iurie said:

great idea  - i think i also have a spare male connector and will wire up the system to van battery and leave the flow open before the pole for a 5 min  that  should get the air out if any 

Many years ago I ordered some minibore hose for my hose reel. The side walls of the hose was very flexible. I found that when I switched the Aquadaptor (hose tap) off the controller seemed to go on forever as the hose was swelling. It was like an additional reservoir. The swelling would make unreeling almost impossible as the expanded hose crushed down in the center spindle. This expansion and contraction caused a loop to form in the hose which kinked when the hose was reeled in. Often I had to completely unreel the hose and then layer it up again. I was doing this a couple of times a day.

Changing the hose reel for the other one on the van identified the problem. Replacing the hose was the way the problem was solved on that hose reel. 

Edited by spruce
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