wfp working from a car any one done it? i have water genie pump n controller 100 m hose 25 ft slx and i was thinking of getting a 250 litre water tank but i dont know how safe that would be and i dont know wether the pump n controller is worth working out of a car and i should of gone down the back pack with a hose and 25 litre batters ?
Welcome to the UK Window Cleaning Forums
Starting or own a window cleaning business? We're a network of window cleaners sharing advice, tips & experience. Rounds for sale & more. Join us today!
wfp working from a car
- Thread starter James102
- Start date
Help Support WCF:
BigFoot
Well-known member
- Messages
- 938
- Location
- South wales
I worked from a Nisan micra starting up years ago and had a trolley system and had 25 ltr water containers all over the car to spread the weight worked well but if I was doing it again I’d get a Gardiner backpack and strap it to a collapsible trolley and fill it up from 25ltr container’. Simple low cost effective system that’s reliable.
once the money rolls in get a van and put a system in it. Best of luck!
once the money rolls in get a van and put a system in it. Best of luck!
i have a 2007 nissan note 5 door i was thinking get a 250 litre tank strap it down and work out of it using the genie pump n controller with a lessure battery ? or do you think it's too dangerous?
ched999uk
Well-known member
- Messages
- 4,771
- Location
- Lancashire
I started with my car, 6x25lts barrels, a gardiner backpack and trolley. I used to put 4 barrels in the boot against the back seats and strapped to the seat belt anchorage points and the other 2 behind the drivers seat on the floor (Honda civic - base of back seats flips up - magic seats) again strapped down. I used to lift back pack and then trolley out of passenger rear door. Strap back pack on trolley and wheel round to back where I would use a 12v pump to transfer pure to backpack - so I didn't need to unstrap barrels!
I used a slx27, a 20m extension hose (pole hose) as that's max length gardiner says to use with their back packs. It did used to be a pain running out of pure in the backpack before I had finished a house and having to refill.
The waterGenie pump in a box is using 'standard wfp' components so will be good and useful if you move to van so you haven't wasted the money - maybe paid a bit more but it should work good in the car. 100m of hose makes it nice and easy to do most jobs. Maybe for a safety point using barrels would be better but you probably need to rig up something to connect multiple barrels to your pump, that way you can run for longer between barrel changes. One issue you will get is air locks, pumps don't like pumping air and you might have to disconnect your reel to allow the pump to prime after draining a barrel.
The 250lts tank in the back sounds like a good idea until you think of the safety aspect - weight distribution - too much in rear effects steering and brakes, securing it in the event of an accident.
Hope that doesn't put you off - just info to think about?
I used a slx27, a 20m extension hose (pole hose) as that's max length gardiner says to use with their back packs. It did used to be a pain running out of pure in the backpack before I had finished a house and having to refill.
The waterGenie pump in a box is using 'standard wfp' components so will be good and useful if you move to van so you haven't wasted the money - maybe paid a bit more but it should work good in the car. 100m of hose makes it nice and easy to do most jobs. Maybe for a safety point using barrels would be better but you probably need to rig up something to connect multiple barrels to your pump, that way you can run for longer between barrel changes. One issue you will get is air locks, pumps don't like pumping air and you might have to disconnect your reel to allow the pump to prime after draining a barrel.
The 250lts tank in the back sounds like a good idea until you think of the safety aspect - weight distribution - too much in rear effects steering and brakes, securing it in the event of an accident.
Hope that doesn't put you off - just info to think about?
ye that's why im shitting myself i paid nearly a grand for hose pole brush pump n controller n 250 litre tank i was going to strap it down in the back seats but is it safe enough so now im rethinking wether i did the wrong thing and i should of got a backpack with the barrels in the boot n run the backpack through 100 m hose
ched999uk
Well-known member
- Messages
- 4,771
- Location
- Lancashire
To be honest only you can decide what level of risk you are happy to take. The main reason I posted was to provide you with info so you could think about things.
Maybe have a look at the seat belt mounts and see if you could attach decent ratchet straps to those points to secure your tank. You need to think about stopping any movement front or rearwards plus MoT requirements - I'm not sure but I think seatbelt use in the rear came in to force about 1991. So even if you remove the rear seats an mot tester might want to see 3 rear seatbelts working in the back as you could put the seat back!
If you think about it 4 average people would weigh about 300kg but distributed between 4 seat belts, plus people can't move that much. When you start using the water the remaining can slosh about a fair bit, so keeping it as low as possible helps.
I would say as a short term measure strap your tank in as low as possible and as well as you can - decent ratchet straps that are actually 'rated' to a few tons and secure them to the seat belt mounts. Maybe start out with just 150lts and see how you go. Be aware of the weight you are carrying and make allowances when driving - bigger stopping distances between the car in front, slower round corners, be more observant etc Within the first few months you will probably see how you are getting on and then consider upgrading to a van as then you can transfer all your kit over and get a frame for your tank and bolt it through the chassis.
Above all do things as safe as you can and inform your insurance company.
Maybe have a look at the seat belt mounts and see if you could attach decent ratchet straps to those points to secure your tank. You need to think about stopping any movement front or rearwards plus MoT requirements - I'm not sure but I think seatbelt use in the rear came in to force about 1991. So even if you remove the rear seats an mot tester might want to see 3 rear seatbelts working in the back as you could put the seat back!
If you think about it 4 average people would weigh about 300kg but distributed between 4 seat belts, plus people can't move that much. When you start using the water the remaining can slosh about a fair bit, so keeping it as low as possible helps.
I would say as a short term measure strap your tank in as low as possible and as well as you can - decent ratchet straps that are actually 'rated' to a few tons and secure them to the seat belt mounts. Maybe start out with just 150lts and see how you go. Be aware of the weight you are carrying and make allowances when driving - bigger stopping distances between the car in front, slower round corners, be more observant etc Within the first few months you will probably see how you are getting on and then consider upgrading to a van as then you can transfer all your kit over and get a frame for your tank and bolt it through the chassis.
Above all do things as safe as you can and inform your insurance company.
- Messages
- 13,553
- Location
- Cornwall
The insurance is a very good point ime 100% sure if you had a tank in the car it would invalidate the insurance , 25 ltr barrels you might get away with it as it could be classed as carrying something that you had bought , but you would still need business use not social domestic and pleasure , it’s not the safest way to work to be honest also I think you are bound to get water spills and ruin the car , if you do do it I would try and get a van asap just for the safety aspect alone .
Daftoldgit
Well-known member
- Messages
- 284
- Location
- Wiltshire
When I switched to WFP I had a Jeep Cherokee, With the back seats folded down I could fit a trolley and six 25 litre barrels, plus one strapped on the passenger seat and one in the footwell. It actually worked quite well, I was a bit limited by the amount of water I had though.
- Messages
- 11,256
- Location
- Durham
When I made the switch to wfp over 14 years ago I started with a car and a PF trolley I got the trolley and 3 containers in the boot and another 5 on the floor in the back.
@James102 you have the right to cancel your order and if you put your order in over the weekend they won't have got it ready for dispatch so you will have no issue cancelling it, I'd personally recommend going down the backpack and barrel route it will be safer and cheaper overall and far less of a worry and a headache.
When driving you can drive like Miss Daisy but it only takes another idiot to cause an accident I nearly went into the back of someone the other week because she slammed her brakes on at the last minute to pull into a parking space at the side of the road I was going up a hill and only doing about 20mph thankfully I was on my way home and my 350ltr tank was empty if it was full I'd gone straight into the back her Range Rover as the road was wet and I skidded
@James102 you have the right to cancel your order and if you put your order in over the weekend they won't have got it ready for dispatch so you will have no issue cancelling it, I'd personally recommend going down the backpack and barrel route it will be safer and cheaper overall and far less of a worry and a headache.
When driving you can drive like Miss Daisy but it only takes another idiot to cause an accident I nearly went into the back of someone the other week because she slammed her brakes on at the last minute to pull into a parking space at the side of the road I was going up a hill and only doing about 20mph thankfully I was on my way home and my 350ltr tank was empty if it was full I'd gone straight into the back her Range Rover as the road was wet and I skidded
In my opinion, you are taking a car and changing its fundamental design purpose. It was designed as a people mover with a little bit of luggage in the boot. The rear passengers are required to be belted in, which should go a long way to protecting front seated people in an accident. Yes, a 5 door hatch will usually have rear seats that can be folded down to take longer loads, but this is for occasional use and more of a marketing tool.
Once you start carrying drums of water that can't be secured properly, then you are asking for trouble, as you are putting that car to a use it wasn't designed for. You could get away with it if you are fortunate, but for me the risks far outweigh the benefits.
I remember, back in my old motor trade days, that the Citroën Berlingo van came out in 3 variants; an 800 kg payload, a 600 kg payload and the Multispace people carrier. The van and the Multispace were identical body shells built on the same floorpan, but to make the Multispace more comfortable for rear seated occupants, the rear suspension was softer, and it only had a payload of 450kg. 450kg doesn't go very far.
There are some things you can't do without the correct equipment or tools to do the job. You can't open a coffee shop if you can't afford tables and chairs or a coffee maker. The correct tool for a wfp window cleaner is a van with a properly secured water tank. Sorry.
This always takes me back to my days with Bosch Power Tools in Johannesburg around 1986. A young couple with very limited finance wanted to start a business fitting window blinds into blocks of flats. They called me in to discuss drills. Virtually every window they were contracting to fit blinds to had a concrete lintel across the top. I recommended a small Bosch pneumatic rotary hammer drill that took SDS drill bits. (In the UK these types of drills are commonly called Hilti drills.) His wife said that they should buy a couple of ordinary percussion drills with a 13mm chuck as they were cheaper. I left him with a demonstrator tool I had in the boot of my car which I collected a few days later.
Many years later we met again and he told me that against his wife's advice he bought the Bosch rotary hammer from one of our dealers, which I knew about. He said it was the best decision he had every made and thanked me for the right advice. He told me that he and his wife had had a blazing argument over his decision after I had left them. But it was the right tool for the job. Their business was thriving and they had moved from the flat they lived in to a nice bungalow. They had grown from the two of them to employing a team of fitters, all with Bosch rotary hammer drills. In later life, this experience always impressed upon me the need have the right tools for the job. There was no guarantee that their business would be successful even with the right tools, but he told me that his business would have failed without the correct drills. What I didn't know before the first visit was that they had already started with cheaper drills and that they were already behind schedule with their contact because things weren't working.
In 2007 we went back to SA for a wedding. I popped into my old company for a visit. One of the product group managers was a nephew of the couple back in 1986. He told me their business was still going strong and the only drills they own are Bosch rotary hammers.
Once you start carrying drums of water that can't be secured properly, then you are asking for trouble, as you are putting that car to a use it wasn't designed for. You could get away with it if you are fortunate, but for me the risks far outweigh the benefits.
I remember, back in my old motor trade days, that the Citroën Berlingo van came out in 3 variants; an 800 kg payload, a 600 kg payload and the Multispace people carrier. The van and the Multispace were identical body shells built on the same floorpan, but to make the Multispace more comfortable for rear seated occupants, the rear suspension was softer, and it only had a payload of 450kg. 450kg doesn't go very far.
There are some things you can't do without the correct equipment or tools to do the job. You can't open a coffee shop if you can't afford tables and chairs or a coffee maker. The correct tool for a wfp window cleaner is a van with a properly secured water tank. Sorry.
This always takes me back to my days with Bosch Power Tools in Johannesburg around 1986. A young couple with very limited finance wanted to start a business fitting window blinds into blocks of flats. They called me in to discuss drills. Virtually every window they were contracting to fit blinds to had a concrete lintel across the top. I recommended a small Bosch pneumatic rotary hammer drill that took SDS drill bits. (In the UK these types of drills are commonly called Hilti drills.) His wife said that they should buy a couple of ordinary percussion drills with a 13mm chuck as they were cheaper. I left him with a demonstrator tool I had in the boot of my car which I collected a few days later.
Many years later we met again and he told me that against his wife's advice he bought the Bosch rotary hammer from one of our dealers, which I knew about. He said it was the best decision he had every made and thanked me for the right advice. He told me that he and his wife had had a blazing argument over his decision after I had left them. But it was the right tool for the job. Their business was thriving and they had moved from the flat they lived in to a nice bungalow. They had grown from the two of them to employing a team of fitters, all with Bosch rotary hammer drills. In later life, this experience always impressed upon me the need have the right tools for the job. There was no guarantee that their business would be successful even with the right tools, but he told me that his business would have failed without the correct drills. What I didn't know before the first visit was that they had already started with cheaper drills and that they were already behind schedule with their contact because things weren't working.
In 2007 we went back to SA for a wedding. I popped into my old company for a visit. One of the product group managers was a nephew of the couple back in 1986. He told me their business was still going strong and the only drills they own are Bosch rotary hammers.
so its already arrived so instead of buying a backpack i have a pump & controller instead of using a 250 litre tank i thought i would buy an 80 litre tank and have some 25 barrels around the car so i can fill the tank n i feel it will be heavy but no way as dangerous as i was going to go for a 250 litre to 150 litre tank do you think that would be safer ?
steve garwood
ginger lion
- Messages
- 7,120
- Location
- Bromley
When I get a couple of days off work I’ll give this a read ??
- Messages
- 11,256
- Location
- Durham
Personally, I just can't see how it will be safe unless fully ratcheted down to prevent forwards and backwards movement but also upwards movement in the event of an accident also you'll need to secure the hose reel as well as they can weigh a fair bit as well,
I hate to be the one to say it but you should have come on here first and asked for advice first
ye iv'e changed the plan i was always going to strap it down i thought ok maybe 150 litre baffle was too big so instead iv'e got an 85 litre water container strap it down with rachets and have 3 more 25 litre barrels around the car also strapped same with reel n i just empty the 25 litre barrels into the 85 litre tank do you think that be safer ?
- Messages
- 11,290
- Location
- Sunderland Tyne and Wear
The way you drive will be the key safety factor. Careful acceleration and keeping a safe distance to the car in front will limit the likelihood of an accident. Your breaking distance will be longer than it is usually due to the inertia generated by the water so I'd advise you take it out and test this out before you find this out in an emergency.
No one on here can tell you if you'll be safe, you've made it safer by lowering the size of tank and the advice you've received on here has hopefully highlighted the dangers you face.
Good luck getting your new venture up and running.
No one on here can tell you if you'll be safe, you've made it safer by lowering the size of tank and the advice you've received on here has hopefully highlighted the dangers you face.
Good luck getting your new venture up and running.
ye i dont plan on driving like an idiot speeding or too close to vehicles im going to strap it down with a ton break racket strap
AndyD
Well-known member
- Messages
- 214
- Location
- South Staffordshire
I’m currently working out of a golf using a pure freedom nano and about 8 x 25lt barrels. Not sure if I’d put an actual tank in as with just 4 barrels in the boot really drops the suspension down. If your low on cash then a backpack and trolley, but if you can afford it get an actual trolley system, great bit of kit and looks a bit more professional.
im using my system like a pump box 3 25 litre barrels in the back seats with an 85 litre tank in the boot
- Messages
- 11,256
- Location
- Durham
Exactly this
i understand i have an idea to lay a sheet of wood and bolt the tank down plus hose and strap it down too the wood just incase i hope that would make it safer
