Bought a 12kW diesel heater with remote control - Hot Water WFP

[NorVik]

Hello ?
I've been offline for a long time now from the forum, and I'm not sure if I did something... not so smart..

Bought a 12kW diesel heater for sole operator

Remote Control

All other stuff

I do not have an heat exchanger or anything like that, I was thinking of perhaps making it a simple solution. But perhaps stupid?

My concern is that there is not any way to perhaps regulate the heat.. Even if the specs of the pump is a bit higher then the normal WFP pump..
But I thought that perhaps if I just use the remote control for the heater to turn off when needed?
 

 

[Pjj]

That will produce far to much heat to go to hose reels  and heat exchangers would be needed , the only way you could use it without would be to use it to heat the water in the tank , 

The diagram you have put in your picture is similar to the way ionics di their thermopure set up but a heat exchangers would be needed. 

 

[ched999uk]

Might be worth using it to just heat the water in the tank. 130psi at 10lpm seems way too high to feed your brush!

You might be able to program it to switch on 90 mins or so before you need it in morning so you have a tank of nice warm water. You could even plumb it in so it runs the hot through your hose into the tank and switch on every now and again over night to act as frost protection.

 

[NorVik]

That will produce far to much heat to go to hose reels  and heat exchangers would be needed , the only way you could use it without would be to use it to heat the water in the tank , 

The diagram you have put in your picture is similar to the way ionics di their thermopure set up but a heat exchangers would be needed. 

Thank you, I hear you... ?

So your saying heat exchangers - like meaning several heat exchangers?
Or will one be enough? Or any advantages with several?

If you look at this picture, he has a heat exchanger + a small water tank in there. Is it necessary to have a small water tank also?

 

 

[NorVik]

Might be worth using it to just heat the water in the tank. 130psi at 10lpm seems way too high to feed your brush!

You might be able to program it to switch on 90 mins or so before you need it in morning so you have a tank of nice warm water. You could even plumb it in so it runs the hot through your hose into the tank and switch on every now and again over night to act as frost protection.

That's a great advice! Thing is that I park in a garage that basically is heating up when getting close to zero. But I do not have an electric outlet there for the immersion heater route, and I do not want to let the diesel heater work inside the garage.

Yeah the pump might be a bit overkill, but I do want to try a bit on using more water. I'm not concerned about saving water if it means I can wash faster. And its also possible to adjust the pump down a bit...

But if my van was outside, that could be super ??

 

[ched999uk]

That's a great advice! Thing is that I park in a garage that basically is heating up when getting close to zero. But I do not have an electric outlet there for the immersion heater route, and I do not want to let the diesel heater work inside the garage.

Yeah the pump might be a bit overkill, but I do want to try a bit on using more water. I'm not concerned about saving water if it means I can wash faster. And its also possible to adjust the pump down a bit...

But if my van was outside, that could be super ??

I wonder if you could use a thermostatic mixer valve to mix cold and the hot to make warm water at the brush? The image you posted with the heat exchanger in the tank has a thermostatic mixer valve (the thing with the silver top) running between the water in and the hot out.

Depending on how long a drive you have before your first job you could get some heat in the tank by just switching in on when you start the van?

A heat exchanger would probably be best and it's fairly easy to setup with a small header tank.

 

[Deleted member 7446]

Hello ?
I've been offline for a long time now from the forum, and I'm not sure if I did something... not so smart..

Bought a 12kW diesel heater for sole operator


Remote Control


All other stuff


I do not have an heat exchanger or anything like that, I was thinking of perhaps making it a simple solution. But perhaps stupid?

My concern is that there is not any way to perhaps regulate the heat.. Even if the specs of the pump is a bit higher then the normal WFP pump..
But I thought that perhaps if I just use the remote control for the heater to turn off when needed?
 

Nice id your building a camper van with radiators 

 

[spruce]

Hello ?
I've been offline for a long time now from the forum, and I'm not sure if I did something... not so smart..

Bought a 12kW diesel heater for sole operator


Remote Control


All other stuff


I do not have an heat exchanger or anything like that, I was thinking of perhaps making it a simple solution. But perhaps stupid?

My concern is that there is not any way to perhaps regulate the heat.. Even if the specs of the pump is a bit higher then the normal WFP pump..
But I thought that perhaps if I just use the remote control for the heater to turn off when needed?
 

You need to understand that a diesel heater isn't an instant heat on demand tankless heater like a tankless gas heater is.

A diesel heater requires time to fire up and time to cool down. It uses a glowplug to heat the diesel up before it ignites. The glowplug uses power from your battery.

These heaters are adapted to our business use. They are originally designed to be used as parking heaters. They are switched on, fire up, and then heat the coolant in the engine block to just below engine operating temperature. They can also be programmed to switch on the vehicle's internal heating system to defrost the windscreen and warm the cabin. This process can take between 30 and 45 minutes.

An engine's cooling system is an internal water circuit that also incorporates an expansion tank. You need to incorporate the principles in a system you design.

On another thread I fitted out a test bed using a Thermo Top C Webasto heater. You must duplicate that.

You also need to understand what a water to water plate heat exchanger looks like and how it works. Plate Heat Exchangers transfer heat energy from one side to another without the two products on either side mixing. So you can install them between the boiler and process circuit for example to separate the two circuits.

https://www.onda-it.com/eng/news/how-a-plate-heat-exchanger-works/plate-heat-exchanger-working-principle

 

[spruce]

Here is a photo I collected from an Ebay seller's advert many years ago. It's a two operator Heatwave system. You can clearly see the 9kw heater at the back and 2 heat exchangers in the front side by side. The header tank is at the top.

 

[spruce]

I wonder if you could use a thermostatic mixer valve to mix cold and the hot to make warm water at the brush? The image you posted with the heat exchanger in the tank has a thermostatic mixer valve (the thing with the silver top) running between the water in and the hot out.

Depending on how long a drive you have before your first job you could get some heat in the tank by just switching in on when you start the van?

A heat exchanger would probably be best and it's fairly easy to setup with a small header tank.

Yes you can Ched. All heaters used in window cleaning (except Ionics) use thermostatic mixer valves to regulate the water temperature being pumped out to the brush. Ours are set at around 50 degrees C leaving the heater.

https://www.butlertechnik.com/webasto-motor-home-plate-heat-exchanger-with-mixer-valve-4111209a-p1516

If you look at the photo of my test bench, the middle and right heat exchanger are fitted with thermostatic mixer valves.

(Ionics marginally regulate the heaters output temperature by using the heaters internal electronic controls. They use a winter and summer setting. The earlier Webasto Thermo 90 ST had a purple cable (I think it was the purple one) that was used for this. Put a 12v + feed to that cable and it gave 1 parameter. Earth the cable and it gave different parameters. Do neither of those actions and the heater gave a third parameter heat output.

 

[Deleted member 7446]

You need to understand that a diesel heater isn't an instant heat on demand tankless heater like a tankless gas heater is.

A diesel heater requires time to fire up and time to cool down. It uses a glowplug to heat the diesel up before it ignites. The glowplug uses power from your battery.

These heaters are adapted to our business use. They are originally designed to be used as parking heaters. They are switched on, fire up, and then heat the coolant in the engine block to just below engine operating temperature. They can also be programmed to switch on the vehicle's internal heating system to defrost the windscreen and warm the cabin. This process can take between 30 and 45 minutes.

An engine's cooling system is an internal water circuit that also incorporates an expansion tank. You need to incorporate the principles in a system you design.

On another thread I fitted out a test bed using a Thermo Top C Webasto heater. You must duplicate that.

You also need to understand what a water to water plate heat exchanger looks like and how it works. Plate Heat Exchangers transfer heat energy from one side to another without the two products on either side mixing. So you can install them between the boiler and process circuit for example to separate the two circuits.

https://www.onda-it.com/eng/news/how-a-plate-heat-exchanger-works/plate-heat-exchanger-working-principle

View attachment 25975

10 out of 10 for plumbing installation 

 

[Pjj]

Thank you, I hear you... ?

So your saying heat exchangers - like meaning several heat exchangers?
Or will one be enough? Or any advantages with several?

If you look at this picture, he has a heat exchanger + a small water tank in there. Is it necessary to have a small water tank also?

 

@spruce has explained it well , but yes the water tank is needed as it’s a header tank holds 5-10 ltr of closed circuit water that goes through the heat exchangers to transfer heat to your hose reel water and it’s a,so used to regulate the water temperature    

 

[spruce]

Thank you, I hear you... ?

So your saying heat exchangers - like meaning several heat exchangers?
Or will one be enough? Or any advantages with several?

If you look at this picture, he has a heat exchanger + a small water tank in there. Is it necessary to have a small water tank also?

 

The heater looks like a copy of the Webasto Thermo top C which is a 5.2kw heater.

 

[kevinc250]

Hello ?
I've been offline for a long time now from the forum, and I'm not sure if I did something... not so smart..

Bought a 12kW diesel heater for sole operator


Remote Control


All other stuff


I do not have an heat exchanger or anything like that, I was thinking of perhaps making it a simple solution. But perhaps stupid?

My concern is that there is not any way to perhaps regulate the heat.. Even if the specs of the pump is a bit higher then the normal WFP pump..
But I thought that perhaps if I just use the remote control for the heater to turn off when needed?
 

hello @NorVika fair few years ago i bought one of those chinese heaters similar to yours, it was a beast and in its intended purpose would perform really well however, for our purposes it would fail as mine did.

how big is your tank? that would decide which way to go down ie heat the tank water or heat the water via an exchange plate

whichever way you decide to go you'll need a smaller fuel pump not a big issue.

hope this helps a bit

 

[spruce]

hello @NorVika fair few years ago i bought one of those chinese heaters similar to yours, it was a beast and in its intended purpose would perform really well however, for our purposes it would fail as mine did.

how big is your tank? that would decide which way to go down ie heat the tank water or heat the water via an exchange plate

whichever way you decide to go you'll need a smaller fuel pump not a big issue.

hope this helps a bit

I also looked at that size diesel heater at one time. I honestly believe that the only way he could use that is to use it to heat all the water in his tank. The problem with that is that it's not the most efficient way of doing it, IMHO. Then again, using a diesel heater isn't either as a percentage of the heat produced disappears out of the exhaust.

I see that David Mcluckie has a couple of YouTube videos out on the Lavaner system. He confirms it has a heat exchanger inside the hot water tank @NorVik. So this company are duplicating what we have explained you need to do.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cwoPa2LO7BI&t=196s