I'm guybrush and i wanna be a mighty window cleaner

[Tuffers]

DIY is your cheapest option Guy. Like Koop said, tank, battery, controller, pump. Add hose and reel, RO and pole and you're basically good to go for under a grand.

EDIT: add resin and DI vessel too.

 

[spruce]

These guys have been advertising on ebay

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/40-INCH-RO-PRO-500-LITRE-WATER-FED-POLE-SYSTEM-/191372973973?pt=UK_HomeGarden_CLV_Cleaning_CA&hash=item2c8eb7d795

Hose reel, hose and pole not included. They are using a well known Shurflo pump and Spring controllers. Not skimping on r/o by supplying cheaper 10" sediment and carbon block filters (system comes with 20" sediment filters.)

They don't supply a leisure battery charger or fit a split charge relay like PF do.

 

[spruce]

Another thing.

The Citroen Vans first opening rear door is the off side. Once that door is open you then open the nearside one after that.

We found that if the van port was installed on the off side, then we kept trampling and 'tripping' over the hose reel and connecting hose when getting stuff from the back of the van.

We find it much better to have the inlet/outlet port on the nearside. My son's Peugeot Partner van has its port on the offside and its a pain for me TBH (I installed it but haven't changed it as the bracket is conveniently bolted to the towing eye.)

I notice that with the Vauxhall Vivaro the first opening door is the nearside one, so the best place for the van ports would be on the offside.

 

[jimmyboots]

Hi Guybrush.

If you are looking for a DIY Van mount guide, this might help you.

I did this back in Feb/March so the prices at the begining of the guide are about right. Less than £650 including Steel frame:thumbsup:

http://windowcleaningforums.co.uk/threads/my-diy-van-mount-build-thread-with-pics-part-1.11790/

http://windowcleaningforums.co.uk/threads/my-diy-build-thread-with-pics-part-2.11791/

http://windowcleaningforums.co.uk/threads/my-diy-van-mount-build-thread-with-pics-part3.11792/

http://windowcleaningforums.co.uk/threads/my-diy-van-mount-build-thread-with-pics-part4.11793/

http://windowcleaningforums.co.uk/threads/my-diy-van-mount-build-thread-with-pics-part-5.11794/

http://windowcleaningforums.co.uk/threads/my-diy-van-mount-build-thread-with-pics-part-6.11795/

If you DIY it, you will know your system and know how to repair it if things go wrong /emoticons/wink.png

 

[spruce]

Unfortunately Jimmy, Guybrush said that his DIY skills were about as good as an ashtray on a motorcycle.

 

[jimmyboots]

Unfortunately Jimmy, Guybrush said that his DIY skills were about as good as an ashtray on a motorcycle.

Oh !/emoticons/biggrin.png . Shame as there's a shedload of money to be saved.

 

[Guybrush]

Spruce- I think if I can tweak the Pure Freedom list and do a bit of bartering I can get the price down. Once I added the leisure battery and hose to the Ebay one I think I would be happier to go with the more established company and not through ebay even if it means paying an extra couple of hundred. Thanks for the link though i'm definately massively more familiar with the items and terminology even in the last 48hrs. The tip about the ports is priceless, that would save so much hassle and it's the little things like that which can ruin or make the day much smoother.

Jimmy- Thanks for the links and yes I am as handy as an ashtray on a motorbike lol it will be like the blind leading the blind but I will go through all those links tomorrow in depth. Need a fresh mind after today to even get started.

I'm starting to think the guys selling the shovels to the gold miners are making more than the gold miners.

 

[spruce]

I don't think you need that second pump to be honest. In the last 8 years of wfp we have never had a pump fail yet once we started using controllers. Prior to that we had a couple of Shurflo pressure switches burn out through 'cycling'.

 

[Guybrush]

Spoke to a different Andy this time. He was really helpful, took time to explain everything and felt like I was talking to an engineer and not a salesman. He took that pump off the list, recommended a 350 litre tank as it would ''sit better'' and could always add another in future if needed (I guess some will disagree with this). He chucked in 7 litres of resin, 3 x 20'' pre filter sets and a full days training on the job which is actually jobs for proper customers not in the back of the car park like I was thinking. Grand total 2780.

I'm bored of hearing myself bang on about it now so i've given myself the weekend to decide. Plus i've done a few football accumulators which with a bit of luck might make the decision easier.

 

[AJ windows]

Welcome to the forum Guybrush, you'll find these guys on here all very helpful. I've only been going 14 weeks myself and these guys have helped me loads. Only difference I went was to go for the trolley system from pure freedom. But I do intend on getting a new van next year with system onboard and running both ststems.

Have you bought a round or are you starting from scratch?

 

[spruce]

Spoke to a different Andy this time. He was really helpful, took time to explain everything and felt like I was talking to an engineer and not a salesman. He took that pump off the list, recommended a 350 litre tank as it would ''sit better'' and could always add another in future if needed (I guess some will disagree with this). He chucked in 7 litres of resin, 3 x 20'' pre filter sets and a full days training on the job which is actually jobs for proper customers not in the back of the car park like I was thinking. Grand total 2780.
I'm bored of hearing myself bang on about it now so i've given myself the weekend to decide. Plus i've done a few football accumulators which with a bit of luck might make the decision easier.

I presume that by "sit better" he meant that the 350 is more ''square' - the 400 is narrower and wider so has a smaller footprint but is taller.

If this is the argument then how would you go for a bigger tank in the future other than replacing it with another tank and frame at considerable extra cost including removing the fuel tank again?

I would seriously consider spending a little more now and not have to replace the tank and frame in the future. A 350 litre tank is much cheaper than a 400 litre by around £35.00 plus VAT.

A 500 litre tank is around £72.00 + VAT more than a 350 litre. I'm sure there won't be much of a price variant for the frame.

Both our single operator vans have 500 litre tanks. We find that each operator uses between 350 and 400 litres of water a day, but there are days when they will use more. Its not uncommon for one of the guys to use his full tank a day.

You can expect to use more water to begin with, especially learning the poling techniques and doing first cleans. You will use a little less water on maintenance cleans after the 2nd and 3rd clean. If you don't have water you can't earn money.

If you do use 350 litres by mid afternoon, then you have no other option but to take the rest of the day off as you can't slip home and fill up again. Having to do that twice in the summer will cost you more in lost earnings than fitting a bigger tank will in the first place.

If you have a 1.9 Dispatch the payload is 815 kgs so as a single operator a full tank of water, pole, hose reel, battery, ladders and roof rack will still be within the van's payload. If you have an Hdi then the van's payload is 900 kgs.

Son has an 800 LX Peugeot Partner (800 kg payload) and Son in Law has a T220 Transit Connect 1.8 Tddi with a payload of 825 Kgs.

That's my opinion anyway.

 

[Guybrush]

Cheers AJ. I know, the guys on here with the experience and willing to put the time in to teach people is brilliant. The feedback has been so helpful and everyone has got their own opinion which makes for a vast amount of info which is great.

You have done very well if your thinking of upgrading already and it's good for me as a beginner to hear it can be done in that time frame, would be interested to know if you started from scratch or bought a round? the trolley route was the exact same route I was going down and i've cheekily/brazenly (time will tell) skipped it because I wanted to do it in one hit and reading thread after thread on here has led me down the rabbit hole a bit and that's the decision i've made. I'm starting from scratch, I know it's crazy and some will say i'm doing it backwards but i'm sticking to my guns.

Spruce- I didn't ask for a smaller tank, he just recommended it, I questioned him twice about this and i'm going to have to follow him up on it now. He was saying how they could just put another tank in (next to it) if needed in the future and I said that would be hassle etc but he was adamant about this. I know exactly what you mean with the water, I done drainage for years and it was pain in the ass when the jetter ran out of water and we had to refill all the time because we had a small tank. If you run out of water in this game when you need It I guess your losing money fast. Thanks again for the info Spruce, it's reading posts like that which made me go for the 400 litre. I have a 1.6 dispatch.

Recommending a 350 litre tank has.... baffled me

 

[andy w]

They were going to put a 350 litre in mine, then when they measured up and checked the payload they went with the 400 litre :thumbsup:

 

[AJ windows]

I didn't buy a round, I have door knocked and leaflet dropped. The main reason for this was firstly I didn't see any rounds for sale and also there is no guarantee with the customer wanting you. Plus when you buy a round the price of cleans on the houses is already set, so it's difficult to increase them if you think they are under priced. Secondly getting your customers yourself, you are dealing with them from day 1 yourself. So you can build a good relationship with them. Explaining the difference between Pure and traditional and I also took my tds meter out with me and showed the customers the difference between what they are drinking (the same water traditional window cleaners use) compared to what we use. I found this a good selling point.

Local windys seem to think I'll only pick up the Crap work or bad payers. Out of 300 or so customers, I've dropped 2. Not a bad percentage.

In regards to trolley system as opposed to tank, I think trolley is more manageable and quicker for most jobs. But once I get my next van I'll have something to compare it too. I'm not sure what van to get next as I don't want to be changing van regularly.

 

[Tuffers]

Trolley vs van mount = no contest. Once you get used to the hose, ie how much to reel out, going round corners etc, you'll find it a lot easier than a trolley. I started with a trolley and only use it on about 5 houses due to access issues.

 

[AJ windows]

Trolley vs van mount = no contest. Once you get used to the hose, ie how much to reel out, going round corners etc, you'll find it a lot easier than a trolley. I started with a trolley and only use it on about 5 houses due to access issues.

Do you leave your hose reel in van or take it out for each job?

 

[spruce]

AJ - we take ours out for each job. Our hose reels are the ones with wheels on them.

With some customers it's easier to walk the hose reel out to the starting point around the back of the property, tie the end off and then wheel the hose reel back to the van laying the hose around obstacles as we go.

 

[spruce]

Spruce- I didn't ask for a smaller tank, he just recommended it, I questioned him twice about this and i'm going to have to follow him up on it now. He was saying how they could just put another tank in (next to it) if needed in the future and I said that would be hassle etc but he was adamant about this. I know exactly what you mean with the water, I done drainage for years and it was pain in the ass when the jetter ran out of water and we had to refill all the time because we had a small tank. If you run out of water in this game when you need It I guess your losing money fast. Thanks again for the info Spruce, it's reading posts like that which made me go for the 400 litre. I have a 1.6 dispatch.

Recommending a 350 litre tank has.... baffled me

I realised that the smaller tank was his suggestion. I just don't understand the reason for the advise other than its more stable because of its squarer shape. (From a window cleaning point of view 50 litres is 2 plastic containers - not much water, but that 50 liters will probably clean 3 x 3 bed semi's on maintenance cleans. If you are getting £10.00 a house, that's £30.00 potential a day just being wasted.) The 500 litre upright tank is also more square and what I would definitely go for.

If you were processing water at home in your garage and could easily slip home and top up, I would still fit a 500 litre tank TBH. I did it for the lads and it was a good decision.

If you tell us where you are based, there will be other cleaners who will help you so you can price to market value in your area. They maybe even tell you where you can canvass with better results. We picked up lots of work in an estate where we knew the window cleaner who packed in worked. Over the years this has happened on a few occassions.

If you make canvassing (the best method in our opinion) a full time job, then there is no reason why you won't build a good business reasonably quickly. You will just have to work at it like your life is involved and you will reap the rewards.

 

[Smurf]

Hi & welcome @Guybrush :thumbsup:

I remember a lad who I recommended loads of stuff including pressure washer kit, guttervac kit and so happens a wfp fitted van mount from pf that after about 6 months he packed it in. The pf system he sold on was hardly used for £1600 including gardiner slx poles etc so was a steal for someone. So what I'm getting at yes you can buy the best you can afford but you also need the drive and determination to make it work as most will fail within the first year.

You only need to look on fleebay etc to see nearly new stuff being sold so that is another option to consider. Mind you also need to be careful as there is plenty of rubbish being sold on their too.

 

[Tuffers]

Do you leave your hose reel in van or take it out for each job?

Yes, the reel is fixed in the van. Could take it out for each job, but I couldn't get on with it out of the van. It has wheels and I found that it kept falling over when reeling out. I screwed down 2 pieces of ply and use 22mm plumbers fixings around the tube to tie it to the ply.

 

[AJ windows]

My hose reel doesn't have wheels on so I guess i'll be pulling the hose from the rear of my van when I get a van mounted system. At the moment I've got a combo, not sure what weight it can hold but it's only just big enough for what work I've gathered in 3 months. So a new van is the only option, only question remains is do I get a leased van and if so can I sign write it. Or do I just buy one and as for what van to go for next i haven't a clue either.