Ladder Mitt safety tip

[Lewisspittle]

I’ve heard rumours and been told of other window cleaners (only ones with reach and wash systems) that you can’t use ladders anymore by law, through health and safety. One window cleaner even went on to tell me that he got fined £1500. Is there any truth to this or is something said by people with reach and wash systems to scare domestic window cleaners off?

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[CM Cleaning Services]

The Work at Height Regulations 2005 require employers and those in control of any work at height activity to ensure that the work is properly planned, supervised and carried out by competent people. This includes using the right type of equipment for working at height. When planning and organising window cleaning you must avoid work at height where it is reasonably practicable to do so, for example by using telescopic water fed poles   or cleaning windows from the inside.

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http://www.hse.gov.uk/cleaning/topics/window-cleaning.htm

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[Dave B]

If you go on hse website you can get all the info

Basically if you use ladders for work and are not in the same spot for more than 20 minutes they have no issue

I am wfp but 24 years trad before and nothing stopping me doing my jobs trad if I wanted. 

It's a stick wagglers trick to get more work

 

[paulben]

Dosent it say you can use ladders if you don't have another way of doing the job .So you cannot use a ladder with wfp gear sitting in your van.

 

[Lewisspittle]

If you go on hse website you can get all the info
Basically if you use ladders for work and are not in the same spot for more than 20 minutes they have no issue
I am wfp but 24 years trad before and nothing stopping me doing my jobs trad if I wanted. 
It's a stick wagglers trick to get more work

Hahaha cheers mate [emoji106]


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[Lewisspittle]

The Work at Height Regulations 2005 require employers and those in control of any work at height activity to ensure that the work is properly planned, supervised and carried out by competent people. This includes using the right type of equipment for working at height. When planning and organising window cleaning you must avoid work at height where it is reasonably practicable to do so, for example by using telescopic water fed poles   or cleaning windows from the inside.

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http://www.hse.gov.uk/cleaning/topics/window-cleaning.htm

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That’s what I mean. That’s not very clear. Cheers though mate


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[monkeyman12]

I hear this from customers all the time, just some wfp guys misinforming people in order to gain more work. A bit like some wfp guys also trying to perpetuate the nonsense that they are environmentally friendly, whilst trad cleaners aren't! ?

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[Dane]

Unless it’s more practical anyway as I’m needing to access a flat roof to clean a window / go behind a property then unless you didn’t have a WFP, why would you want to climb up and down a ladder? I’m in the process of completely going wfp, a chap near me has fallen off a ladder on a school for a company and from what I hear it’s not ended well.... it’s not worth the risk (whether the ladder is safely and properly used or not)

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[monkeyman12]

Unless it’s more practical anyway as I’m needing to access a flat roof to clean a window / go behind a property then unless you didn’t have a WFP, why would you want to climb up and down a ladder? I’m in the process of completely going wfp, a chap near me has fallen off a ladder on a school for a company and from what I hear it’s not ended well.... it’s not worth the risk (whether the ladder is safely and properly used or not)
 
 
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Horses for courses I guess Dane. Obviously wfp is safer than working on ladders, but I prefer to do trad work, and have minimalised the risks by getting the safest ladders I can, and by not doing risky manoeuvres.
Cars are safer than motorbikes, but people will still ride bikes.
I've seen so many condescending posts about not cleaning trad, and we should all go wfp, but I don't think anyone here will lecture motorcyclists about the dangers of riding a motorbike everytime they go out on it.
I personally don't know anyone who's buggered themselves up coming off ladders....


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[Dane]

Totally understand and each to their own, I’m saying that I personally am moving over to wfp for my own peace of mind.... I haven’t and won’t use the spiel of saying “ladders are illegal”.... I work on my own, now that I’ve invested in equipment I just don’t want to run the risk of falling off (however unlikely) in someone’s back garden and being stuck there until someone finds me... had I not invested then I would of course have to continue using a ladder


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[Lewisspittle]

Unless it’s more practical anyway as I’m needing to access a flat roof to clean a window / go behind a property then unless you didn’t have a WFP, why would you want to climb up and down a ladder? I’m in the process of completely going wfp, a chap near me has fallen off a ladder on a school for a company and from what I hear it’s not ended well.... it’s not worth the risk (whether the ladder is safely and properly used or not)
 
 
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Yeah to be fair I’d rather not just with the return on investment being questionable. I’ve found alot of people try lying to themselves on the fact is doesn’t return on their investment also because they feel have to with how much they’ve spent on it


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[monkeyman12]

Totally understand and each to their own, I’m saying that I personally am moving over to wfp for my own peace of mind.... I haven’t and won’t use the spiel of saying “ladders are illegal”.... I work on my own, now that I’ve invested in equipment I just don’t want to run the risk of falling off (however unlikely) in someone’s back garden and being stuck there until someone finds me... had I not invested then I would of course have to continue using a ladder


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I'd go wfp if I lived in a soft water area, or if where I lived I could harvest rain water efficiently, and that may be the case one day if my situation changes.
But I'd still do trad work too.
Hope your transition over to wfp goes well.
I'd want an electric hose reel set up I reckon. [emoji4] And the lightest poles on the market.
Stick waggling is harder on the body than trad cleaning I'd say.

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[Dane]

Of course mate, which is why I said “unless you didn’t have wfp” I still have ladders on my van


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[rugbywolf]

Unless it’s more practical anyway as I’m needing to access a flat roof to clean a window / go behind a property then unless you didn’t have a WFP, why would you want to climb up and down a ladder? I’m in the process of completely going wfp, a chap near me has fallen off a ladder on a school for a company and from what I hear it’s not ended well.... it’s not worth the risk (whether the ladder is safely and properly used or not)

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Well a; it keeps you healthy, and b; you are close up to the window and can actually see if it's clean or not. I wish that wfp people  would just get on with it and stop deriding trad workers.

 

[Dane]

As I’ve already said “unless you didn’t have a wfp” and in another comment that “I would still use a ladder if I hadn’t invested”, I also still have a ladder on the van and I wouldn’t use the term “ladders are illegal” then I’m sure I’m not deriding anyone.... I shall “get on with” my transition and wish you all the best with your trad work


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[Redditch windy]

Horses for courses I guess Dane. Obviously wfp is safer than working on ladders, but I prefer to do trad work, and have minimalised the risks by getting the safest ladders I can, and by not doing risky manoeuvres.
Cars are safer than motorbikes, but people will still ride bikes.
I've seen so many condescending posts about not cleaning trad, and we should all go wfp, but I don't think anyone here will lecture motorcyclists about the dangers of riding a motorbike everytime they go out on it.
I personally don't know anyone who's buggered themselves up coming off ladders....


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i do!

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[monkeyman12]

i do!

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Well to give it some context I know at least a dozen or more people who've either been killed or seriously maimed themselves on motorbikes....
And push bikes too! Should those be avoided then by everyone?
Only cars allowed? [emoji848]


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And what about stairs in houses.... People fall down those occasionally, and break their necks! Bungalows must be much safer. [emoji6]

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[Seth]

Have fallen 22 feet off a roof due to a dodgy roof ladder. 

Had a design fault. Long story but as soon as there was weight on lower end of the ladder the ridge hook would lift off the roof. Had a mate who was a roofer and had no fear of heights who tried it on my bungalow. He nearly came off too.

I was very,very lucky as when I hit the ground I tucked and rolled, (Ex Army) and sitting there the rest of the ladder, which was tied off to my extention ladder, swung round and hit me on the side of my head. Was not happy. Two cracked ribs and an excuse to call it a day and went to the pub.

I'm a biker of 30 years. Have lost a lot of friends on bikes including a good friend killed 3 foot from me by a car driver.

I use WFP and have been since mid '00's.

Personally I tell customers if they ask why am I not using a ladder I say that the working at heights regs state "that if there's an alternative to using ladders then it must be considered" and so I choose the method where both my feet are on the ground and," See that window above your porch? Can clean that easy!"

Keep it simple. 

Certainly don't slag off "tradders" or say ladders are illegal. Life's too short to argue with other people unless it's with dodgy customers who owe me money and then I just send them CCJ's and walk away.

Touching on bikes again, similar thing on a bike page on FB this morning about people wearing t-shirts and shorts on motorbikes and some calling them stupid while others are saying it's their choice.

Personally, I wear leathers in all weathers, I have 2 feet on the ground when cleaning windows. Live and let live. ?

 

[Dane]

Have fallen 22 feet off a roof due to a dodgy roof ladder. 
Had a design fault. Long story but as soon as there was weight on lower end of the ladder the ridge hook would lift off the roof. Had a mate who was a roofer and had no fear of heights who tried it on my bungalow. He nearly came off too.
I was very,very lucky as when I hit the ground I tucked and rolled, (Ex Army) and sitting there the rest of the ladder, which was tied off to my extention ladder, swung round and hit me on the side of my head. Was not happy. Two cracked ribs and an excuse to call it a day and went to the pub.
I'm a biker of 30 years. Have lost a lot of friends on bikes including a good friend killed 3 foot from me by a car driver.
I use WFP and have been since mid '00's.
Personally I tell customers if they ask why am I not using a ladder I say that the working at heights regs state "that if there's an alternative to using ladders then it must be considered" and so I choose the method where both my feet are on the ground and," See that window above your porch? Can clean that easy!"
Keep it simple. 
Certainly don't slag off "tradders" or say ladders are illegal. Life's too short to argue with other people unless it's with dodgy customers who owe me money and then I just send them CCJ's and walk away.
Touching on bikes again, similar thing on a bike page on FB this morning about people wearing t-shirts and shorts on motorbikes and some calling them stupid while others are saying it's their choice.
Personally, I wear leathers in all weathers, I have 2 feet on the ground when cleaning windows. Live and let live. [emoji846]

Spot on mate


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[monkeyman12]

Have fallen 22 feet off a roof due to a dodgy roof ladder.  Had a design fault. Long story but as soon as there was weight on lower end of the ladder the ridge hook would lift off the roof. Had a mate who was a roofer and had no fear of heights who tried it on my bungalow. He nearly came off too. I was very,very lucky as when I hit the ground I tucked and rolled, (Ex Army) and sitting there the rest of the ladder, which was tied off to my extention ladder, swung round and hit me on the side of my head. Was not happy. Two cracked ribs and an excuse to call it a day and went to the pub.I'm a biker of 30 years. Have lost a lot of friends on bikes including a good friend killed 3 foot from me by a car driver.

I use WFP and have been since mid '00's.

Personally I tell customers if they ask why am I not using a ladder I say that the working at heights regs state "that if there's an alternative to using ladders then it must be considered" and so I choose the method where both my feet are on the ground and," See that window above your porch? Can clean that easy!"

Keep it simple. 

Certainly don't slag off "tradders" or say ladders are illegal. Life's too short to argue with other people unless it's with dodgy customers who owe me money and then I just send them CCJ's and walk away.

Touching on bikes again, similar thing on a bike page on FB this morning about people wearing t-shirts and shorts on motorbikes and some calling them stupid while others are saying it's their choice.

Personally, I wear leathers in all weathers, I have 2 feet on the ground when cleaning windows. Live and let live. [emoji846]

That's why I've got the safest ladders that I can have. Fitted them with stabiliser legs and an adjustable base, that makes it safe when working on uneven ground. The base also makes the footprint of the ladders wider too, and theyre A frame, so none of this over extending malarkey. Of course, I could still fall off it, but I've minimalised the risks as far as I possibly can. A bit like yourself wearing leathers as opposed to someone wearing shorts and a tshirt on a bike.And on that note, I think it's up to them.I've worked with chainsaws a lot in forestry, and I've known people not wear the trousers with ballistics in them to prevent you chopping your legs off! To me, it's not the best idea, but it was their choice.

In Australia they have to run the gauntlet of minimal chainsaw protection, as in the summer heat, tree surgeons would be at severe risk from heat exhaustion wearing all the gear.

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[rugbywolf]

It's not so much about safe ladders, as how you use them. Done properly, you are quite safe. I've had two falls in fifty years, fortunately not serious.