Should I be using so much water?

[Stevieboy]

That seems like a lot of water to me. You might not be over cleaning but maybe you’re rinsing too much??

I have a 350ltr tank that lasts me 2 days with a bit to spare.
6 hour days at £150-£200

Yep me to. I’ve got my controller set just in double figures. Also use a tap. The mentality on here is to pump as much water out as possible. You can normally tell the self taught WFP user by the amount of water they waste. Lots also look like they are jet washing the windows. 

 

[scottish cleaning service]

You can never use enough water is what I was lead to believe. My problem is with first cleans because I use degreaser and dash of fairy. Now they all say I'm leaving their glass streaky and I say its because its a first clean. Anyway, I'm getting fed up with it and will be ditching the degreaser for first cleans and just using pure. I thought it was a good idea but not now.

 

[Stevieboy]

I use a little TFR on first cleans. Wouldn’t bother with the fairy. Never had a problem. Try your degreaser without fairy mate. Do all the hard work with tap water and then just polish glass with a little pure. That’s what I do on first cleans. 

 

[wezza13]

I just use purified water on first cleans. Did an initial clean today that hadn’t been cleaned in 5 years. Came up lovely and didn’t take long at all ??

 

[Cleanteam South west]

Have a look at your practices, ie jets, turning water off while moving and do you also connect and disconect your hose reels between jobs ? 

When I first started We had a bumper manifold and would pull our two hose reels from the van and connect up, you end up wasting loads of water. 

 

[Tango]

It really baffles me how everyone else using much less than me!   

I was in your boat for a while.. however now i struggle to get through half a back pack. I did a 2 storey house a while back.. normally 2 barrels.. didn't even use one last time.

So my theory is that there are several things at play; you get quicker (without realising it) as time goes on, you become more efficient (eg going from one upstairs window to another and another.. then adjusting the head and doing the sills - instead of window, sill, window, sill), some get a univalve, you get to know the fastest way around each house you clean, windows stop collecting as much dirt after the first few cleans which makes them faster to clean..

But while all of those contribute I noticed one very big issue which I think has been overlooked by everybody: Voltage.

I stupidly left my back pack in the car on some seriously cold nights - many times. Batteries don't particularly like the cold - it damages them and reduces their capacity to store electrons - or current if you prefer. With this, there is a lowered voltage. Just like car batteries.. as they age their nominal voltage drops when the engine isn't running. A battery that might once sit at 13.5v (for a 12v battery) might start sitting at 12.5 and then discharge down to 10.7V instead of 11.2V.

With a lower voltage comes a slower pump speed. You might have it set on 65% but if you leave it set there but the voltage is lowering and lowering then you'll start using less and less water but as far as you're concerned it's still set at 65%.

My BP used to be empty after 25mins. Now I can get well over 40 from it. Imagine all those van setups with leisure batteries (eg gel batteries - which also don't like the cold).. being left out in all weathers... voltages dropping.. pump speeds slowing...

The newer your battery, the faster your pump will operate - meaning the more water you'll use.

You're all more than welcome to call me a total nutter...

 

[Pjj]

I was in your boat for a while.. however now i struggle to get through half a back pack. I did a 2 storey house a while back.. normally 2 barrels.. didn't even use one last time.

So my theory is that there are several things at play; you get quicker (without realising it) as time goes on, you become more efficient (eg going from one upstairs window to another and another.. then adjusting the head and doing the sills - instead of window, sill, window, sill), some get a univalve, you get to know the fastest way around each house you clean, windows stop collecting as much dirt after the first few cleans which makes them faster to clean..

But while all of those contribute I noticed one very big issue which I think has been overlooked by everybody: Voltage.

I stupidly left my back pack in the car on some seriously cold nights - many times. Batteries don't particularly like the cold - it damages them and reduces their capacity to store electrons - or current if you prefer. With this, there is a lowered voltage. Just like car batteries.. as they age their nominal voltage drops when the engine isn't running. A battery that might once sit at 13.5v (for a 12v battery) might start sitting at 12.5 and then discharge down to 10.7V instead of 11.2V.

With a lower voltage comes a slower pump speed. You might have it set on 65% but if you leave it set there but the voltage is lowering and lowering then you'll start using less and less water but as far as you're concerned it's still set at 65%.

My BP used to be empty after 25mins. Now I can get well over 40 from it. Imagine all those van setups with leisure batteries (eg gel batteries - which also don't like the cold).. being left out in all weathers... voltages dropping.. pump speeds slowing...

The newer your battery, the faster your pump will operate - meaning the more water you'll use.

You're all more than welcome to call me a total nutter...

I think he is  using a van mount not a back pack , so the battery will be much bigger capacity and shouldn’t affect the flow like it can with backpack 

 

[Tango]

I think he is  using a van mount not a back pack , so the battery will be much bigger capacity and shouldn’t affect the flow like it can with backpack 

Yes and it's newer - so the pump will be running faster than the rest of you on older leisure batteries.

 

[Iron Giant]

350ltr tank which due to were I park when I fill my van on a slight incline which also slopes off to the left means I only manage to fill around 325 litres or so, I return home with 25 litres plus in the tank, I use 1.4mm pencil jets and have my controller set on 29 I can on average clean 25 houses a day 

I rinse well and efficiently, I don't skimp on water usage, I do have the knack of nipping the hose between windows as needed such as on a straight forward house I will clean the front upper windows first, nip the house then clean the back upper windows, do the lower back windows, nip the hose and complete the fronts. 

 

[mike007]

Cheers bud. Mines not like that it’s 1-99 and I keep it on around 37. If I had it on the max 99 would that be 5 litres per minute? I really don’t understand why I use so much.. ?? 

Work out your settings by getting a bucket and running the water from your pole into it for  a minute till you get the flow rate of 2ltr a minute.

 

[Iron Giant]

You can never use enough water is what I was lead to believe. My problem is with first cleans because I use degreaser and dash of fairy. Now they all say I'm leaving their glass streaky and I say its because its a first clean. Anyway, I'm getting fed up with it and will be ditching the degreaser for first cleans and just using pure. I thought it was a good idea but not now.

Any washing up liquid can be a nightmare to rinse away thoroughly and certainly not needed to be added to tfr, I did a job years ago and the custy said her husband had cleaned the bay window with fairy but it looked a mess, he must have used half a bottle, I scrubbed and rinsed that window I don't know how many times I was sure it would come up good, went and did the back double checked it and it needed cleaning again, so I did it again scrubbing and rinsing multiple times 

It was my last job of the day, so I told her ring me to let me know how it comes up, following morning can you come back please, I scrubbed and rinsed the window 3-4 times and no bubbles at all coming down the glass, later that day got another call can you come back please, I had to politely explain that after spending 30 minutes plus travel on one window that I was losing money and she had to accept that her husband had caused the issue, she was all good and the next clean it was spot on and she was on my rounds for well over a year until she needed to cancel due to losing her job

 

[Rickadoo]

350ltr tank which due to were I park when I fill my van on a slight incline which also slopes off to the left means I only manage to fill around 325 litres or so, I return home with 25 litres plus in the tank, I use 1.4mm pencil jets and have my controller set on 29 I can on average clean 25 houses a day 

I rinse well and efficiently, I don't skimp on water usage, I do have the knack of nipping the hose between windows as needed such as on a straight forward house I will clean the front upper windows first, nip the house then clean the back upper windows, do the lower back windows, nip the hose and complete the fronts. 

Do you not find that on hydrophobic glass you need a lot of water tho? My univalve broke once early in the day and I quickly adapted to the art of nipping the hose but the thing with that is when it gets caught on the wheelie bin while you’re pulling it round the back or you need to open a gate you don’t have a hand spare and the water goes everywhere.

 

[Stevieboy]

Do you not find that on hydrophobic glass you need a lot of water tho? My univalve broke once early in the day and I quickly adapted to the art of nipping the hose but the thing with that is when it gets caught on the wheelie bin while you’re pulling it round the back or you need to open a gate you don’t have a hand spare and the water goes everywhere.

I’ve got a tap on all my poles so don’t suffer from water wastage when the pole gets snagged or opening gates.  If I was a pipe nipper I would pull out round the back first not start at the front. Must be a nightmare nipping pipe one hand holding pole with the other opening gates with the other one. Unless you have lots more hands than me. 

 

[CHWS]

You can never use enough water is what I was lead to believe. My problem is with first cleans because I use degreaser and dash of fairy. Now they all say I'm leaving their glass streaky and I say its because its a first clean. Anyway, I'm getting fed up with it and will be ditching the degreaser for first cleans and just using pure. I thought it was a good idea but not now.

I only ever use pure for first cleans. Only time I’ve hit the windows with degreaser is when doing the frames on a full pvc clean and all it seems to do is make black seals bleed like a ***** 

 

[Neil.. Lancashire]

Hi guys. 
 

I’ve got a 500L tank, most days it just about lasts me when I’m doing on average 15 houses, (around £150) in 6 hours. I know it’s not a lot compared to most of you guys, as I’ve not been doing it long and built it up from scratch.
 

When I’m doing more compact work on new estates I’m running out of water after about 18 houses (average house £10). So I’ve been taking a few 25L drums with me to top me up.. 

Is it normal that I’m using so much water? 
 

I’m pretty sure I’m not over cleaning, I’m cleaning the frames quickly, then I go over the glass once or twice and give it a quick rinse. Since using them 3mm pencil jets on my brush, I usually have my flow on 37. Them jets seem to slow the flow of the water, as I used to have it on 32.
 

I’m on the verge of looking for a bigger van so I can fit a 1000L tank in, so I’ll have enough water for 2 people to work all day. I’ve got someone canvassing for me to try and compact my work and build it up enough to have someone else on the windows with me.

Can anyone that’s used a 1000L tank recommend any van that’s suitable for the weight? 
 

Many thanks, Luke. 

I Have 1000l in my Mavarno medium roof and wheel base works well. Lots of room inside but its doing mainly commercial were there is more room to park it. You will notice the difference with the bigger van when parking.

 

[Part Timer]

I’ve got a tap on all my poles so don’t suffer from water wastage when the pole gets snagged or opening gates.  If I was a pipe nipper I would pull out round the back first not start at the front. Must be a nightmare nipping pipe one hand holding pole with the other opening gates with the other one. Unless you have lots more hands than me. 

Nip the hose and stick it up the end cap, this keeps it nipped and releases your hand.

 

[Luke Macclesfield]

Have a look at your practices, ie jets, turning water off while moving and do you also connect and disconect your hose reels between jobs ? 

When I first started We had a bumper manifold and would pull our two hose reels from the van and connect up, you end up wasting loads of water. 

Yes I’m going to order some 2mm jets. Is it best using a univalve? Is a univalve what attaches to the pole? I’ve just got a stop valve on the connectors (pole to reel). No I don’t disconnect my reel I just work with my van doors open. I have a 2 man set up but only have 1 reel connected, on the other pump that I don’t use the hose that would be connected to the reel is just laying across my van. Would waste water be coming out of that?? 

Can somebody please explain what pencil jets are designed to do, in comparison to not using them? I’ve tried googling it but google doesn’t seem to know.. lol. 

 

[Luke Macclesfield]

Work out your settings by getting a bucket and running the water from your pole into it for  a minute till you get the flow rate of 2ltr a minute.

Does the same amount of water get pumped out per minute, no matter what pencil jets you have on your brush? 

 

[Pjj]

Yes and it's newer - so the pump will be running faster than the rest of you on older leisure batteries.

provided the battery’s are fully charged it won’t make any difference to flow rate , only if the diaphragm s ard starting to perish will you notice a difference on flow rate on one of my vans one pump is 7 years old and one 2 years and there is no difference in the out put 

 

[Martyn]

Does the same amount of water get pumped out per minute, no matter what pencil jets you have on your brush? 

Thinking about it my personal experience with 3mm jets goes back a long way, possibly before the advent of fancy controllers, so you be may right. What I do know is that many experienced window cleaners agreed with my experience back in the day.

 

[Part Timer]

Does the same amount of water get pumped out per minute, no matter what pencil jets you have on your brush? 

Yes, the only difference will be the pressure it comes out at, i.e. the smaller the jet the greater the pressure.