Fan jets vs pencil jets

[Dirty dan]

Hi Lads , I have fan jets and pencil jets on all my brushes put them on myself . Then when you want either one for different jobs all you do is switch hose on brush to conn ect to small jg fittings 

I’ve got different brushes with different jets that only take a few seconds to twist off and change around, I was just curious if anyone actually used the two at the same time

 

[Davy G]

Hi folks, I've been looking into rinse bars. 

I don't think they'll be viable for us at the moment because they use more water than the 100 degree fan jets. Our 650ltr tank often runs very low, even using these.

On one occasion last week we only managed to finish our last job of the day by dropping the front right wheel into a dip on the corner of a gravel drive to get the last drop out of the tank. We did over twenty jobs that day. Not an especially large number but most were large country houses with conservatories (some had two) and others had garden art studios, gyms etc. 

My son will be working on his own from December 3rd until at least mid January, while I'm in hospital for a major operation. He might try a rinse bar then as he'll have plenty water for a sole operator and it might well be slightly quicker.

I know he's sweet and happy with his kit and technique as is currently, so will take some persuading. 

 

[paul alan]

Tell him to have a quick look at this video, this how I clean windows. Note how I only do 2/3 of the movements you have to do with rinsing off. It does take some getting used to but not too long.

You just have to agitate in a way that the rinse follows where it must go, once you've got it down you'll have an easier life.

 

[Den]

Hi folks, I've been looking into rinse bars. 

I don't think they'll be viable for us at the moment because they use more water than the 100 degree fan jets. Our 650ltr tank often runs very low, even using these.

On one occasion last week we only managed to finish our last job of the day by dropping the front right wheel into a dip on the corner of a gravel drive to get the last drop out of the tank. We did over twenty jobs that day. Not an especially large number but most were large country houses with conservatories (some had two) and others had garden art studios, gyms etc. 

My son will be working on his own from December 3rd until at least mid January, while I'm in hospital for a major operation. He might try a rinse bar then as he'll have plenty water for a sole operator and it might well be slightly quicker.

I know he's sweet and happy with his kit and technique as is currently, so will take some persuading. 

I personally use the low pressure rinsebar the flow rate is set at the same as using 100 degree fan jets.

@paul alan uses the normal rinsebar but he has the luxury of carrying more water than myself. Nice demo Paul ?

Using the low pressure bar I still clean basically the same as Paul's video with great results ?an important factor is the correct use of the swivel. 

 

[Dirty dan]

56 minutes ago, paul alan said:

Tell him to have a quick look at this video, this how I clean windows. Note how I only do 2/3 of the movements you have to do with rinsing off. It does take some getting used to but not too long.

You just have to agitate in a way that the rinse follows where it must go, once you've got it down you'll have an easier life.

Thanks for this, awesome video. I’ll be getting one of these first thing Monday ?

 

[Davy G]

I could be wrong but it does look to me like you're using more movements, more effort, more water and more time than I do with the 100 degree fan jets and is slightly heavier. 

I expect you probably slowed it down a bit for your demo. A good video for sure. 

I also see that Squeeky Clean Dave has gone back to 100 degree fan jets after trialling two types of rinse bars for some time, from two different manufacturers. 

I will try a rinse bar at some time for sure. ?

 

[tench0771]

for me ive found pencles much beta tryed fans and allways hit problims with them there just not accerut enough 

 

[Davy G]

for me ive found pencles much beta tryed fans and allways hit problims with them there just not accerut enough 

All down to technique and staying against the glass. The key is to contain the water between the glass and the brush to avoid overspray, allowing a contained positive water pressure, aided by gravity, to flow down from the brush taking the dirt with it. I think where people are going wrong is that they are not doing this and instead are spraying water into the air, which, with the 100 degree fan jets will be an uncontrolled spray doing its own thing and nothing much useful. ?

 

[paul alan]

All down to technique and staying against the glass. The key is to contain the water between the glass and the brush to avoid overspray, allowing a contained positive water pressure, aided by gravity, to flow down from the brush taking the dirt with it. I think where people are going wrong is that they are not doing this and instead are spraying water into the air, which, with the 100 degree fan jets will be an uncontrolled spray doing its own thing and nothing much useful. ?

 I get what your saying and have done what your saying in the past, but, it doesn't always work for me. You (I) get bristle tip water left on the glass which can dry dirty- sideway spotting. With the rinse bar the last thing to ever touch the glass is pure water.

Mate if you can work quicker than that with fan jets and leave no spotting on the glass then you "must" do a video for me to see. I am always looking to learn anything that makes work easier, faster, better quality.

 

[Davy G]

Yeah mate, we're all just trying to do our best with everything : efficiency, speed, quality. I might do a video. We each just settle on what we feel suits us. We all learn from each other. There probably won't be much difference in the end between either of us with time or quality. In the end it's down to personal preferences. ?

 

[Iron Giant]

Hi Lads , I have fan jets and pencil jets on all my brushes put them on myself . Then when you want either one for different jobs all you do is switch hose on brush to conn ect to small jg fittings 

I know a lad who also has this set up as it's just what he prefers for certain jobs, I personally have never had an issue with pencil jets in over 11 years, but fans would be a nightmare for me on new build estates. 

 

[Marko067]

I had 2mm pencils and 100° fans on my brushes simultaneously for a while in case I felt the need to use one over the other,but found once I had the hang of using the fans I just didn't ever need to use the pencils so have recently removed them. I have a lot of vents at the top of windows on my round and just found too much water splashing into them with pencils when rinsing off the glass. I can foresee the same issues with vents using a rinse bar. Davy G's method with the 100° fans is definitely the best method for me. Has been for a number of years now.

 

[Davy G]

Hi Paul you asked me to do a video showing my method with fan jets. I finally got round to it. 

The system is : Water heated to about 60c using 2kw immersion, temp at brush about 50c (would probably be half that temp in really cold weather by the time it's gone through all the hose), Gardiner SLX22 pole, univalve, standard quick lock, plastic swivel, extreme sill brush with 2x 100 degree fan jets.

I realised when I looked at the video that somehow I missed one of the small top opening windows on the back of the conservatory. Customer didn't complain though as she didn't spot it and anyway she was just glad to have her windows cleaned for the first time in ages. Customer is Da wife. ?

I've been trying to upload it but without success. I think the file is too big. I'm not familiar with uploading videos. Don't know what the answer is. I'm reluctant to go on YouTube. 

 

[Pjj]

Hi Paul you asked me to do a video showing my method with fan jets. I finally got round to it. 

The system is : Water heated to about 60c using 2kw immersion, temp at brush about 50c (would probably be half that temp in really cold weather by the time it's gone through all the hose), Gardiner SLX22 pole, univalve, standard quick lock, plastic swivel, extreme sill brush with 2x 100 degree fan jets.

I realised when I looked at the video that somehow I missed one of the small top opening windows on the back of the conservatory. Customer didn't complain though as she didn't spot it and anyway she was just glad to have her windows cleaned for the first time in ages. Customer is Da wife. ?

I've been trying to upload it but without success. I think the file is too big. I'm not familiar with uploading videos. Don't know what the answer is. I'm reluctant to go on YouTube. 

I had exactly the same same thing on hear couldn’t upload a video I think it was to large and I have no idear how to make it smaller , Ime not good with computer related things ??

 

[Davy G]

I had exactly the same same thing on hear couldn’t upload a video I think it was to large and I have no idear how to make it smaller , Ime not good with computer related things ??

Me neither. ??

 

[paul alan]

Hi Paul you asked me to do a video showing my method with fan jets. I finally got round to it. 

The system is : Water heated to about 60c using 2kw immersion, temp at brush about 50c (would probably be half that temp in really cold weather by the time it's gone through all the hose), Gardiner SLX22 pole, univalve, standard quick lock, plastic swivel, extreme sill brush with 2x 100 degree fan jets.

I realised when I looked at the video that somehow I missed one of the small top opening windows on the back of the conservatory. Customer didn't complain though as she didn't spot it and anyway she was just glad to have her windows cleaned for the first time in ages. Customer is Da wife. ?

I've been trying to upload it but without success. I think the file is too big. I'm not familiar with uploading videos. Don't know what the answer is. I'm reluctant to go on YouTube. 

Thats a shame, I just picked up a 14" extreme with 4 black fan jets too. I had a go of it but still dont know what I'm doing with them.

Maybe speak to the moderators?

I hope you can sort it mate, looking forward to seeing it.

 

[Davy G]

Thats a shame, I just picked up a 14" extreme with 4 black fan jets too. I had a go of it but still dont know what I'm doing with them.

Maybe speak to the moderators?

I hope you can sort it mate, looking forward to seeing it.

Keep the brush tight to the window throughout the wash (including the rinse) to prevent overspray but not pressed hard against it. Light touch, full length, fast strokes. That's the key. Scrub only when you have to (bird muck and spider poo etc) 

You'll find it a bit strange and alien for a while probably but you might get to like them. 

Maybe one of the moderaters will see this discussion and advise what to do. ?

 

[Den]

Keep the brush tight to the window throughout the wash (including the rinse) to prevent overspray but not pressed hard against it. Light touch, full length, fast strokes. That's the key. Scrub only when you have to (bird muck and spider poo etc) 

You'll find it a bit strange and alien for a while probably but you might get to like them. 

Maybe one of the moderaters will see this discussion and advise what to do. ?

Maybe @Gav gave can upload the video file ?

 

[paul alan]

Keep the brush tight to the window throughout the wash (including the rinse) to prevent overspray but not pressed hard against it. Light touch, full length, fast strokes. That's the key. Scrub only when you have to (bird muck and spider poo etc) 

You'll find it a bit strange and alien for a while probably but you might get to like them. 

Maybe one of the moderaters will see this discussion and advise what to do. ?

Only thing I cant never get past is the bristle tip marks left on the glass when it's hydrophobic.

When I clean hydrophobic I like to leave as little water on the glass as possible, especially around the top of the pane. Any water left on hydrophobic glass could dry dirty, more so if it's windy as the dust will cling to the leftover water. If I pulldown slowly straight down on hydrophobic glass it dries the glass as it rinses, capillary action from the bristle tips pulls the water droplets back into the brush. If I fan from side to side then I always get bristle tip sideway spotting, these dry dirty on some windows, I know this for sure as I've tested it extensively.

I would just love to see it done by someone who has mastered it. I personally have little faith in rinsing on, even with hydrophilic glass. It would make working life much easier though so I'm eager to learn the technique.

Be great if I could see the vid before work in the morning so I can bash away it all day tomorrow.

 

[Dirty dan]

After seeing somewhere about a rinse bar, I’ve started using this as well as the fans. You really do have to change your technique after being used to pencils. I’ve noticed as well @paul alan that I have to pull down on rinse instead of sweeping side to side. 

 

[Davy G]

I've never noticed a problem with any type of glass. Including leaded. I've been using basically the same technique since I started six years ago. I've always used fan jets, starting with the red ones but been using the black ones (100 degree) since I discovered them. I always bring a continuous sheet of water down. 

I'll try and get round the video posting problem as soon as I can.