Securing Tank To My Van

[rcproperty]

how thick is the ply? if its thick enough you can just lay some timber round the bottom edge of the tank and screw it down

 

[Extremecleansussex]

Anyone on here who recommends anything other than a fully crash tested system is potentially asking for trouble in the event of an accident. Be careful what you say!

 

[rcproperty]

Anyone on here who recommends anything other than a fully crash tested system is potentially asking for trouble in the event of an accident. Be careful what you say!

not really, i only offer tried and tested advise on anything, i built my own system and have had it check out and they have said its fine.

the timeber that i have said about is only for a temp measure until he can afford to get it frame for it.

 

[Extremecleansussex]

not really, i only offer tried and tested advise on anything, i built my own system and have had it check out and they have said its fine.

the timeber that i have said about is only for a temp measure until he can afford to get it frame for it.

How can you say it's tried and tested? Have you have it crash tested by MIRA? All I'm saying is that you're leaving yourself open to litigation if you advise someone to use a timber frame and he gets himself seriously injured by following your advice.

 

[rcproperty]

How can you say it's tried and tested? Have you have it crash tested by MIRA? All I'm saying is that you're leaving yourself open to litigation if you advise someone to use a timber frame and he gets himself seriously injured by following your advice.

could you point me to where i say only use a wooden frame to sucure the tank??? because reading back there is nowhere that i can see that says this.

he has several rachet straps holding it in place, which is fine, then i said just put a bit of timber round the bottom of the tank to stop it sliping until you can afford to get frame fitted.

i would never tell anyone anything unsafe, if you read other topics on here that i have posted or answered to you will notice that a few people are not that keen on me as the advise they give is not right and i correct them to the safe way of doing it. at the end of the day i wouldnt like anyone to get hurt doing something that i have said, its a life at the end of the day.

if you wish to discuss this any more could you use private mail and not on the open forum.

 

[Extremecleansussex]

how thick is the ply? if its thick enough you can just lay some timber round the bottom edge of the tank and screw it down

Here! Post #22

I appreciate that you are trying to be helpful as am I, I just think that you're on risky ground recommending anything that isn't successfully crash tested.

What you chose to put in your van and how you chose to secure it is your business but you cannot legitimately say that it's tried and tested or inspected and been cleared as safe unless you've either had it crash tested or been in a crash and had it proven that way.

Do you honestly think that a piece of timber screwed into plywood would stop 650kg of mass in a 30mph crash even when held down with straps.

I really don't mean to be argumentative with you but by the same token I don't want someone to get injured because they took your opinion as fact.

I'd me more than happy to continue this discussion by pm if you wish.

Dave

 

[M.K Cleaners.co.uk]

Here! Post #22

I appreciate that you are trying to be helpful as am I, I just think that you're on risky ground recommending anything that isn't successfully crash tested.

What you chose to put in your van and how you chose to secure it is your business but you cannot legitimately say that it's tried and tested or inspected and been cleared as safe unless you've either had it crash tested or been in a crash and had it proven that way.

Do you honestly think that a piece of timber screwed into plywood would stop 650kg of mass in a 30mph crash even when held down with straps.

I really don't mean to be argumentative with you but by the same token I don't want someone to get injured because they took your opinion as fact.

I'd me more than happy to continue this discussion by pm if you wish.

Dave

Why did they only test it at 30mph? What happens at 40, 50, 60, 70 mph. Is it still the same results? If its not that should really pull that video. Its gives of the impressions that it its 100% safe when in fact its not. All vans are different some can withstand more impact than others. and some are stronger some are weaker (older vans)

 

[rcproperty]

Here! Post #22

I appreciate that you are trying to be helpful as am I, I just think that you're on risky ground recommending anything that isn't successfully crash tested.

What you chose to put in your van and how you chose to secure it is your business but you cannot legitimately say that it's tried and tested or inspected and been cleared as safe unless you've either had it crash tested or been in a crash and had it proven that way.

Do you honestly think that a piece of timber screwed into plywood would stop 650kg of mass in a 30mph crash even when held down with straps.

I really don't mean to be argumentative with you but by the same token I don't want someone to get injured because they took your opinion as fact.

I'd me more than happy to continue this discussion by pm if you wish.

Dave

i'll pm you, i'll only get moaned at again if i carry on! lol

 

[Haydn Herbert]

Why did they only test it at 30mph? What happens at 40, 50, 60, 70 mph. Is it still the same results? If its not that should really pull that video. Its gives of the impressions that it its 100% safe when in fact its not. All vans are different some can withstand more impact than others. and some are stronger some are weaker (older vans)

To be fair we're not talking about the strength of the vans mate were talking about having a half ton weight unsecured in the back of the van. The videos show what happens at 30mph, a reasonable and standard speed most cleaning vans will reach. The secured tanks may not hold at 50 60 70mph etc, but one thing is for sure, an unsecured tank at just 30mph has a very high chance of coming into the cabin and killing you in the event of a crash. I drive with my kids in the van sometimes and it's not something I would risk.

Would you drive around with 500kg of unsecured steel in the back of the van ? I know I wouldn't.

 

[M.K Cleaners.co.uk]

To be fair we're not talking about the strength of the vans mate were talking about having a half ton weight unsecured in the back of the van. The videos show what happens at 30mph, a reasonable and standard speed most cleaning vans will reach. The secured tanks may not hold at 50 60 70mph etc, but one thing is for sure, an unsecured tank at just 30mph has a very high chance of coming into the cabin and killing you in the event of a crash. I drive with my kids in the van sometimes and it's not something I would risk.

Would you drive around with 500kg of unsecured steel in the back of the van ? I know I wouldn't.

What is the frame secured too? The van!

Im not disputing that an usecured tank wont come thorugh. It deffo would. What annoys me is that the had the crash test done and peoples buying in to it thinking its safe. Yes its safe if you crash at 30mph. Who drives round at 30mph all day? Im pretty confident if you have it strapped down with racthcet straps and something round it to stop it sliding it wouldnt come loose at 30mph. Anything more and I think it would.

 

[Extremecleansussex]

The frame is secured to the van chassis with high tensile bolts and the crash tested ones will not move in a 30mph crash. Yes you can crash faster and it may not hold but you can't drive round in a fire engine all day!!

If you think about it, for a large part of the day you're probably not going over 30mph anyway and it's the best available so the safest you can get.

Hopefully you're never going to crash so it's all just a discussion but I wouldn't want to be driving round in a van with the tank held in place with timber and ratchet straps.

 

[CNS-southwest]

How can you say it's tried and tested? Have you have it crash tested by MIRA? All I'm saying is that you're leaving yourself open to litigation if you advise someone to use a timber frame and he gets himself seriously injured by following your advice.

He is not giving professional advice, he is giving personal experiences, if the op chooses to follow what RC or anyone else has said, then that's at the OP risk....

Any claims court will throw that out

 

[laddergarder]

I don't have any experience with any of this, but I would add if any of you are fans of Ice road truckers, you see a lot heavier items held on with nothing but straps, and it is considered safe practice. The vehicle may not have had a crash test, however the straps are purpose built to secure loads and they have been thoroughly tested.

 

[M.K Cleaners.co.uk]

The frame is secured to the van chassis with high tensile bolts and the crash tested ones will not move in a 30mph crash. Yes you can crash faster and it may not hold but you can't drive round in a fire engine all day!!

If you think about it, for a large part of the day you're probably not going over 30mph anyway and it's the best available so the safest you can get.

Hopefully you're never going to crash so it's all just a discussion but I wouldn't want to be driving round in a van with the tank held in place with timber and ratchet straps.

The strength of the chassis will vary on each van, also age will most likely be a factor in how strong that is too.

So because your driving at 30pmh most of the day it makes it all right? lol.

What about people there only cover commercial work, or should I say large commercial work. They will be travelling a lot. on motorway, county roads. There sppeds going to be way higher. Now they may have got there system installed on the basis of that video thinking there going to be safe when if fact there not. This wont just effect that type of company but anyone who does a lot of travelling at higher speeds.

Its just a gimmick I reckon to get people to buy in to there prodcut

 

[Extremecleansussex]

I don't have any experience with any of this, but I would add if any of you are fans of Ice road truckers, you see a lot heavier items held on with nothing but straps, and it is considered safe practice. The vehicle may not have had a crash test, however the straps are purpose built to secure loads and they have been thoroughly tested.

They travel on the ice at less than 15mph and I remember one episode when they were carrying pipes where they discussed the pipes going through the cabin.

 

[CNS-southwest]

Just an ideas, could you not use the metal frame of the old school office desks, n just cut and re bolt it to make a frame ?????

 

[Extremecleansussex]

The strength of the chassis will vary on each van, also age will most likely be a factor in how strong that is too.

So because your driving at 30pmh most of the day it makes it all right? lol.

What about people there only cover commercial work, or should I say large commercial work. They will be travelling a lot. on motorway, county roads. There sppeds going to be way higher. Now they may have got there system installed on the basis of that video thinking there going to be safe when if fact there not. This wont just effect that type of company but anyone who does a lot of travelling at higher speeds.

Its just a gimmick I reckon to get people to buy in to there prodcut

Think what you like, I know what I'd rather have behind me in my van and your views clearly differ from mine so we'll just have to agree to differ.

 

[M.K Cleaners.co.uk]

Just an ideas, could you not use the metal frame of the old school office desks, n just cut and re bolt it to make a frame ?????

Unless the desk was made by pure freedom, No. lol

 

[laddergarder]

They travel on the ice at less than 15mph and I remember one episode when they were carrying pipes where they discussed the pipes going through the cabin.

They do travel on ice at slow speeds ur absolutely correct, but they also travel at higher speeds when they are not on the ice. I don't want to join in on the point scoring here, but IMO straps are safe, as long as the loads and checked as they don't exceed the manufacturers recommendations, then I would be quite happy, and feel very safe.

 

[CNS-southwest]

Unless the desk was made by pure freedom, No. lol

Lol

 

[toronto]

I would say the weakest point on most people's strapped systems will be the anker points or the strap rating. the load restraints on the van are too weak. load rated eye bolts with shackles fitted though the floor with spreader plates on the under side should be a minimum. I prefer overkill so a strap rated at 1000 kg may restrain a tank during normal conditions or lift the tank but in crash conditions the force on the strap will far exceed 1000 kg so I therefore use 15000 kg rated straps ankor bolts and shackles along with 10 mm thick angle restraints to prevent sliding.

a steel frame does not guarantee safety any more than straps and both will work as well provided the correct mounting are used and carefully consideration is taken when choosing your methods.