warm/hot water for barrels trolly system good or bad idea??

[dasslr1]

I was watching another post last week on heated van systems , someone was thinking about putting a small submersive fish tank heater in one of his tanks ,I think a 250 ltr tank .Knowing full well itll not heat it up to the point of getting hot water but enough to take the chill off the water and not ice up over the coming winter . it got pointed out to him that itll be no point the tanks to large blah blah so on. I thought to myself I don't have a van system but I use 20 ltr barrels I wonder if I could do it ?? the idea being drop it in one barrel while going to a job then move it to the next barrel while I'm using the heated barrel . and so on all day . obviously there'll be a bit of DIY in involved i.e. hooking it up to the battery(the one on the trolley ) and maybe I was thinking somehow fixing it to the lid of the barrel for easy putting it in and taking out .that way if it fixed to the lid when screwed on itll not touch the sides . has any one thought about or done something similar . its just an idea at the mo but is it worth looking into ,I'm I on to a winner or just a waste of time? iv been trad for 14 years and wfp for over 18 months last winter wasn't bad at all but thinking this winter might be snowy icey cold af . when iv trad in the morning winter months the waters always froze on the glass or parts of the glass ,how badly does this happen when using wfp ?and does it really matter if you use hot or cold water in freezing weather . yes iv finished today and instead of cleaning the kitchen iv decided to come up with something that may or may not help over winter . just thoughts and ramblings would it / could it work ???

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Aquarium-Adjustable-Water-Heater-Submersible-Thermostat-Tropical-Fish-Tank-A/263296799172?hash=item3d4db651c4:m:mSVp_enpAonFUGXg_1MkIIw

 

[Cghwindowcleaning]

Warm water freezes quicker than cold and the time it takes to heat as well as the thin wall of the barrel is not worth it.

I have used cold for years in bad winters hot water would not of helped me continue it is very, very rare to lose a day to cold weather.

 

[dasslr1]

thank you I didn't even consider the thinness of the barrel plastic I suppose itll be a losing battle trying to heat it up if it were ever that cold to need a heater . mmmm  oh well one day ill have an idea thatll be good hahaha its not a total waste iv managed to successfully not clean the kitchen for the past hour lol haha     well I never knew that .....https://www.bing.com/search?q=does+hot+water+freeze+faster+than+cold&form=EDGTCT&qs=AS&cvid=4f9afd213a174ebea074638d51892ceb&cc=US&setlang=en-US.

 

[Nudel]

Even if you insulated the barrel while heating, a battery wouldn't hold up as the amount of power needed to heat the water would drain it very fast. So a gas system would be needed.

Don't think the effort would be worth it.

Now, a small heater run off the cars 12v system to keep the trad bucket at decent temperature, that could possibly work.

 

[Marko067]

I have a cabin in my garden that houses a 400ltr upright tank, my RO and an L5 gas water heater.

Using an old Surflo and 12v power supply to pump the water through the heater it fills a 25ltr barrel in 9 minutes with 45° water. I normally heat 7 barrels and they last me from 9am to about 2pm. Because I use a saloon car to transport my kit it all stays very toasty in the boot. The last barrel is still about 30° by the time I get to use it.
If you use a small van I woukld suggest bringing an old blanket or duvet to throw over it to hold the heat in.
I don't find it speeds me up noticeably but it is nicer to use especially on those really cold or freezing days. There are also definitely days I have worked that I would not have been able to if I wasn't using it.

 

[spruce]

Firstly, the element you linked to is 230v not 12 volts.

Here is a 12v heating element.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Tea-Coffee-Kid-Bottle-Immersion-Heat-Boiler-Element-Car-ZY-12V-24V-Water-Soup/322546945469?hash=item4b194bcdbd:m:mPglwH4gSySAOa-vG4vizUA

However, this element is expected to draw 140 watts. At 12 v that is nearly 12 amps. That about 3 headlight bulbs on bright.

We used something similar 42 years ago when my son was a baby to heat the water in his bottle before mixing it with powdered milk formula when we were on a long journey in South Africa. The instructions for use where that this should only be used when the engine was running as it would easily flatten a small battery. It took quite sometime to heat a baby's bottle of water to warm enough to baby temperature, so I wouldn't hold out much hope for it doing a satisfactory job.

 

[oldtimer]

hi you lot I am  an old trad man have been for the last 40yr   no w have got meslf a trolly   set up  and  I DONT GET ON WITH IT   gets me goat the bloody thing now tell me do you lot  only do tops with the   pole  cos I tell ya why I am  freakin knackerd  filling my  trolly every other house

 

[Marko067]

I was a trad man for 30yrs before I switched to wfp 10yrs ago. At first it was like learning a new trade. For the first few weeks getting used to it and working out the best way to use my kit was a bit tedious but once I got it all figured out, I really got into it. I get through double the work and more now than I would if I was still trad. The extra work involved setting up in the morning is more than worth it.

I started out poling the tops and tradding the bottoms but as I became more proficient at using my gear I moved to fully wfp.

I also only use a Pure Freedom trolley, though I have modded it to lighten it considerably. I also work from a car which will carry 8 barrels of water  (9 at a squeeze) plus trolley. Most of the time I only carry 6 or 7. I just use each barrel then pop another one on. It's quick n easy.

 

[Iron Giant]

hi you lot I am  an old trad man have been for the last 40yr   no w have got meslf a trolly   set up  and  I DONT GET ON WITH IT   gets me goat the bloody thing now tell me do you lot  only do tops with the   pole  cos I tell ya why I am  freakin knackerd  filling my  trolly every other house

If you have got a cheap heavy pole and vikan brush meant for buses then you will be knackered, And to be fair if you are in your 50's you will be knackered I couldn't be doing with it in my 40's, I used a trolley for 3-4 years and got fed up off messing on with lugging containers about and back injuries. Been using a truck mount for over 6 years now and it's a breeze in comparison .

 

[Green Pro Clean Ltd]

Even if you insulated the barrel while heating, a battery wouldn't hold up as the amount of power needed to heat the water would drain it very fast. So a gas system would be needed.

Don't think the effort would be worth it.

Now, a small heater run off the cars 12v system to keep the trad bucket at decent temperature, that could possibly work.

Just use a cool box instead of a bucket. Fill with hot in the morning and then again at lunch and you'll have toasty water all day. 

 

[Green Pro Clean Ltd]

hi you lot I am  an old trad man have been for the last 40yr   no w have got meslf a trolly   set up  and  I DONT GET ON WITH IT   gets me goat the bloody thing now tell me do you lot  only do tops with the   pole  cos I tell ya why I am  freakin knackerd  filling my  trolly every other house

This is why I have never advocated trolly systems as a stand alone alternative to trad.  They are a good accessory to your existing WFP system for the occasional hard to reach areas but not for use by themselves. 

People by trolley to 'give window cleaning a try' and either quit or sell the trolley or spend an age trying to figure how to turn it into some kind of vehicle mount. 

This is why I have always said van systems are the way forward. 

 

[Neilmnwc]

Out of curiosity I checked the outside ambient temperature when using WFP a couple of winters ago, it was still flowing at -2.
The water was cold straight from garage RO. It froze as it landed on the floor but
I carry rocksalt to grit areas of access/egress, customers appreciate it too.


Sent from my iPhone using Window Cleaning Forums

 

[CleanerWindows]

If your worried about freezing get some bioethinol to put in your water. It does help and you'll be buzzing like a tramp on chips after inhaling it all day ?

Sent using the http://Window Cleaning Forums mobile app

 

[Green Pro Clean Ltd]

I was watching another post last week on heated van systems , someone was thinking about putting a small submersive fish tank heater in one of his tanks ,I think a 250 ltr tank .Knowing full well itll not heat it up to the point of getting hot water but enough to take the chill off the water and not ice up over the coming winter . it got pointed out to him that itll be no point the tanks to large blah blah so on.

Well that's total toss. It works just fine. 

Dropped to 3 degrees here last night so I banged on my new heaters for a test.  

I have 2 300w fish tank heaters.  One in the filling section one in the middle section and the thermometer is in the rear section (coldest part) 

To help you get the gist of what I mean my tank has 2 baffles so 3 areas as it were. 

The controller is set to 25 degrees out of the box and I haven't adjusted it yet. I will lower it keep the water at around 10 degrees and with a 500L tank that will prevent anything in the van from freezing. 

Took this pic first thing having put the heaters on at 8pm last night. 



If You're wondering why it says 100 it's cause I went to the next setting that has nothing to do with it.  The top reading of 17.4 was my water temperature and even if so did set for 100 it wouldn't matter as the heater elements max out at 32. 

 

[Marko067]

Just another bit of info while I think about it for any that may be thinking about putting hot water in barrels.

I do this as I said before and it works very well for me. However, temp wise the limit I've discovered for the barrels I use is about 45°. Anything higher and they start to buckle when you pick them up due to going soft in the heat.

 

[Tuffers]

hi you lot I am  an old trad man have been for the last 40yr   no w have got meslf a trolly   set up  and  I DONT GET ON WITH IT   gets me goat the bloody thing now tell me do you lot  only do tops with the   pole  cos I tell ya why I am  freakin knackerd  filling my  trolly every other house

Get a van mount. Problem solved.

 

[J and S]

I lasted a year with trolley and barrels before I switched to van mount...much better way of working..for my rounds anyway.

Now I wish I had bought a larger tank.

 

[J and S]

Only had to buy the tank though stripped the trolley and used pump, controller and battery for van mount.

Plus have it set up so can use trolley if ever needed.

 

[dasslr1]

hi you lot I am  an old trad man have been for the last 40yr   no w have got meslf a trolly   set up  and  I DONT GET ON WITH IT   gets me goat the bloody thing now tell me do you lot  only do tops with the   pole  cos I tell ya why I am  freakin knackerd  filling my  trolly every other house

I have diy trolly ,can put the hose that goes to the pump straight in a barrel soon as that's empty take hose out then straight into the next barrel next to no  lifting at all  . I got /made it just to do awkward windows then it started ...... just the tops and I trad bottoms that was just to save water really now its mostly wfp everything lol . I do like doing some easy jobs trad  and wagtail on pole .eg bottom floor work windows just over head . 

 

[oldtimer]

I have diy trolly ,can put the hose that goes to the pump straight in a barrel soon as that's empty take hose out then straight into the next barrel next to no  lifting at all  . I got /made it just to do awkward windows then it started ...... just the tops and I trad bottoms that was just to save water really now its mostly wfp everything lol . I do like doing some easy jobs trad  and wagtail on pole .eg bottom floor work windows just over head . 

thanks bud glad o ya tip   ya right it makes sense   i will just use it  up top       :1f44d:

 

[oldtimer]

If you have got a cheap heavy pole and vikan brush meant for buses then you will be knackered, And to be fair if you are in your 50's you will be knackered I couldn't be doing with it in my 40's, I used a trolley for 3-4 years and got fed up off messing on with lugging containers about and back injuries. Been using a truck mount for over 6 years now and it's a breeze in comparison .

hi bud i am  64 and still going strong    i aint spending big bucks on a van mount at my time o life   i think i will just go back to trad and use the wfp for hard to reach   jobs        and in answer to ya ? i use a very light carbon pole   its a   fishing pole   great bit o kit as for me brush got it from tescos    drilled couple a holes in it stuck in some fan jets     its a good job every time customers love it  its just the humping the bloody water bout that knacks me lol      been in this game 40yrs loved every  day of it   great life    be sorry to  call it a day  i aint packing in till the bell goes what else is there  ?  a f...king armchair  then the crem      not for me lads     work till ya drop     :1f603: :1f603: