Wfp system advice

[dazmond]

Personally if I were you id get a brand new van and fit a 500L tank...if you ve no plans for expansion and have many years left as a sole trader window cleaner then your van and system will last you 10 years+....

Unless of course you like the hassle of messing about changing systems every few years from one van to the next..

A 350L tank is just too small for  most WFP cleaners.. remember you should never totally drain your tank every day or you just end up with air locks galore...

You'll also use lots more water when your a newbie wfp cleaner until you gain experience so a 350L tank will be empty by lunchtime 

 

[Iron Giant]

You'll also use lots more water when your a newbie wfp cleaner until you gain experience so a 350L tank will be empty by lunchtime 

Quiet holiday ?

 

[Yogi1872]

In all honesty you are just going to have to bite the bullet and take a hit in the early days by doing all windows wfp plus the extra time it takes to do first cleans which can be X 2-3longer than a regular wfp clean now you could do this in blocks this could be done by going out on your own wfping as many houses as you can in a day then dropping onto the ladder later on or as @spruce said top up at customers houses as you will have an onboard Di Vessel 

Your worker am guessing will possibly have to go and I'm assuming that's your long term plan to be on your own, because if you're content to lose 1K plus of work then it's already in your mind along with only kitting out your van with a 1 man system, but you won't lose that much work you'll get the weirdo's who don't want their windows leaving wet also you don't want to send mix messages by tradding downs or saying you'll trad custys who don't want wfp, the ones who don't want wfp is the ones you can loose and you can refine your rounds

Also just to say people talk on here about needing a bigger van and 500ltrs of water, I have 350ltr tank and carry x2 25ltr containers on some days I can easily clean 25-30 houses a day a make a good wedge, granted some days less houses but that's when I am doing larger jobs I clean over 400 jobs  mostly on a 4 weekly schedule on my own ? 

 

I have went with the assumption I will be myself tbh because the other guy cant drive. Also something happened around a month ago and I told him he was sacked.  Trying to get someone else in the winter proved a struggle. If weather could be guaranteed 5 days a week I'd manage to get round it all myself.  I was falling behind. If you can clean windows youl pick up shifts pretty easily so he was working elsewhere .  With no one there to help catch up I had to cut my nose of to spite my face as not taking him back was only punishing my interests as I was behind.  If I had a pole system already in place then I don't need the ladder footed and if I did fall behind then getting someone for a few shifts is more appealing for them as there not climbing ladders.  Taking into consideration I'm going to loose some work then maybe I would be able to maintain my work even if I lost days through weather as I'd have space with the houses that cancel.

That was the other reason why in introducing it to the top windows for 3 or 4 months.  That's when il know who's okay with it and who's going elsewhere then il get a true figure of the work I'm going to be going forward with.  There's some I know who il still have to do it traditional. Like most jobs window cleaning is repetitive. So a couple of days a month doing trad will break the cycle.  I have a couple of streets that are all bungalows. I don't think il swap them over as the thing everyone hates most (climbing ladder) doesn't get done anyway.  There's a street I do where someone must feed thr birds as every second window seems to have it on it.  For quickness thst day will still be done trad.

 

[Jango]

We moved over from trad to wfp. If I were in your shoes I would move everybody over. If you just do upstairs with the pole in time it will frustrate you. You will be propping stuff up going back to the van for trad gear etc. Losing time. You will be surprised you won’t lose many. You will be apprehensive at first we were, but once you have got going with it, you’ll wish you had swapped over sooner. All the best with it.  

 

[Yogi1872]

We moved over from trad to wfp. If I were in your shoes I would move everybody over. If you just do upstairs with the pole in time it will frustrate you. You will be propping stuff up going back to the van for trad gear etc. Losing time. You will be surprised you won’t lose many. You will be apprehensive at first we were, but once you have got going with it, you’ll wish you had swapped over sooner. All the best with it.  

Someone else will be doing thr bottom windows the first 3 or 4 times. So one will use pole and one just for bottoms.  If after 3 and 4 cleans the top windows are no different to the bottom windows and the customer acknowledges that then there won't be any problems.  It's only going to be an issue if after 4 months the top windows aren't at least on par with the bottom ones which are being done trad.  I've done the run for years now so il get that 3 to 4 months Lee way from 99% of them.  Even after 4 months and even if they weren't happy I think you would still keep 60 to 70% of them just because they don't want to tell you they want to cancel so will just keep you for the sake of it.

 

[Part Timer]

 It's only going to be an issue if after 4 months the top windows aren't at least on par with the bottom ones which are being done trad

If they're not better after the 2nd wash, and you're doing them properly, they will never be better. 

 

[scottish cleaning service]

Doesn't matter if you do the windows 100% some will complain. I had that with the bitter customers. Through time they have came round or I was ditching them. Did it for free a few times to manage their pain that wfp was the real deal and I wasn't going back to Trad. Now its accepted as self-evident and their bin lids get cleaned at same time. ?

 

[Yogi1872]

Customers have asked about the water fed pole before and if it works. Luckily whenever I've been asked I've not slated it. I've told them I've seen examples of it doing better than us but on the other end I've seen it leave a mess.  It would be alot harder to introduce of I had been bad mouthing it because it wasn't the way I used at the time.  There's a domestic window cleaner I know who employs 19 workers. Hel have a big expense when he has to change over.

 

[dazmond]

Quiet holiday ?

 I couldn't go mate...I tested positive last wed...I've not had any symptoms at all...allowed to go out today as i tested negative today and yesterday so it was a quiet Xmas at home with the missus,daughter and her boyfriend!?

 

[dazmond]

New here and first post.  Changing over from traditional to wfp. I have a mercedes citan and it's 700 kg payload so I won't be able to get one of the bigger litre tanks.  I was going to go for the facelift compact either 325 litre or 425 . I bought one of there carbon fibre poles already.  I haven't a clue about these things and the machine looks very easy to work.  That reason is the only thing that's swayed me towards it.

I'm in a soft water area. I notice some systems are cheaper than others. What justifies ones being priced higher than others ?. Do they do something the compact doesn't ?.  I'm based in Scotland and called Douglas at aqua but he's not fitting systems anymore only selling them, so any recommendations for him is out the window.   Again I haven't a clue how to fit anything and I'm not attempting it so that's out of the question.  Are there any other systems like the compact where from what I understand its looks like its just water in with the di option then your sorted ?.   Was waiting until the 1st of January to order it on the off chance I'd maybe save a few quid if they decide to have a sale.

If you go for a small tank you ll be changing it(and your van)within a year of going WFP...

 

[dazmond]

I have went with the assumption I will be myself tbh because the other guy cant drive. Also something happened around a month ago and I told him he was sacked.  Trying to get someone else in the winter proved a struggle. If weather could be guaranteed 5 days a week I'd manage to get round it all myself.  I was falling behind. If you can clean windows youl pick up shifts pretty easily so he was working elsewhere .  With no one there to help catch up I had to cut my nose of to spite my face as not taking him back was only punishing my interests as I was behind.  If I had a pole system already in place then I don't need the ladder footed and if I did fall behind then getting someone for a few shifts is more appealing for them as there not climbing ladders.  Taking into consideration I'm going to loose some work then maybe I would be able to maintain my work even if I lost days through weather as I'd have space with the houses that cancel.

That was the other reason why in introducing it to the top windows for 3 or 4 months.  That's when il know who's okay with it and who's going elsewhere then il get a true figure of the work I'm going to be going forward with.  There's some I know who il still have to do it traditional. Like most jobs window cleaning is repetitive. So a couple of days a month doing trad will break the cycle.  I have a couple of streets that are all bungalows. I don't think il swap them over as the thing everyone hates most (climbing ladder) doesn't get done anyway.  There's a street I do where someone must feed thr birds as every second window seems to have it on it.  For quickness thst day will still be done trad.

Trust me when your up to speed with WFP and a decent size tank and system you will get all your work cleaned with days to spare and no employees necessary.?

I have 340+ jobs(mostly 4 weekly) and easily get my work cleaned working 25 hours a week

 

[Yogi1872]

If you go for a small tank you ll be changing it(and your van)within a year of going WFP...

That was sort of the plan if I needed it. I don't have 20 to 30k sitting to buy a bigger van plus system at the moment.  I'm going to watch what I spend next year and put alot away.  Then a year or a year and a half down the line I could get a bigger van and system.

 

[dazmond]

That was sort of the plan if I needed it. I don't have 20 to 30k sitting to buy a bigger van plus system at the moment.  I'm going to watch what I spend next year and put alot away.  Then a year or a year and a half down the line I could get a bigger van and system.

Surely if your turning over 5k a month you could afford a bigger van and system...just get one on finance or lease

 

[Yogi1872]

Surely if your turning over 5k a month you could afford a bigger van and system...just get one on finance or lease

I could yeah, but I also earn enough money that if I need something I can save up for it.  I'd rather save for 1 year than pay finance for 5. 

 

[dazmond]

Each to their own...I'll let you make your own mistakes/purchases!?

 

[Iron Giant]

I have went with the assumption I will be myself tbh because the other guy cant drive. Also something happened around a month ago and I told him he was sacked.  Trying to get someone else in the winter proved a struggle. If weather could be guaranteed 5 days a week I'd manage to get round it all myself.  I was falling behind. If you can clean windows youl pick up shifts pretty easily so he was working elsewhere .  With no one there to help catch up I had to cut my nose of to spite my face as not taking him back was only punishing my interests as I was behind.  If I had a pole system already in place then I don't need the ladder footed and if I did fall behind then getting someone for a few shifts is more appealing for them as there not climbing ladders.  Taking into consideration I'm going to loose some work then maybe I would be able to maintain my work even if I lost days through weather as I'd have space with the houses that cancel.

That was the other reason why in introducing it to the top windows for 3 or 4 months.  That's when il know who's okay with it and who's going elsewhere then il get a true figure of the work I'm going to be going forward with.  There's some I know who il still have to do it traditional. Like most jobs window cleaning is repetitive. So a couple of days a month doing trad will break the cycle.  I have a couple of streets that are all bungalows. I don't think il swap them over as the thing everyone hates most (climbing ladder) doesn't get done anyway.  There's a street I do where someone must feed thr birds as every second window seems to have it on it.  For quickness thst day will still be done trad.

It's a sensible way to start off to avoid loosing to much income in the first few months, but once you switch to do the the downs you'll get behind as well but I hope it all goes well for you, as for bungalows the old folks love the switch as they are getting the doors washed down as well and I'd get a scraper from Gardiners for the street with all the bird ? most of it comes off quite easily with wfp also you don't want people to start asking why you are going up the ladder for those ones and bring in doubt, 

I clean over 430 jobs most 4 weekly and manage with a 350ltr tanks plus x2 25ltr containers and I ain't killing myself I don't start till around 9am and finish before 4pm a man op should have no issue managing with 350-400ltrs a good working pace and flow rate gets through jobs easily.

 

[Jonny 67]

The bigger picture here is this. Once you get the tops wfp and you become confident and competent, then you'll want to do everything wfp. The chimp part of your brain will be filling you with doubts, but once you've taken the leap you'll do everything wfp. Dazmond makes some very good points. If you're going to need a bigger tank in the future then you're better doing it now, if you can. Kitting out a van is not rocket science, but not easy either! It time consuming getting the right van, then kitting it out. I wouldn't want to do it twice in 12 months! 

 

[Jonny 67]

That was sort of the plan if I needed it. I don't have 20 to 30k sitting to buy a bigger van plus system at the moment.  I'm going to watch what I spend next year and put alot away.  Then a year or a year and a half down the line I could get a bigger van and system.

I recently saved £6k off list price on a very low mileage, nearly new van. ?

 

[spruce]

The bigger picture here is this. Once you get the tops wfp and you become confident and competent, then you'll want to do everything wfp. The chimp part of your brain will be filling you with doubts, but once you've taken the leap you'll do everything wfp. Dazmond makes some very good points. If you're going to need a bigger tank in the future then you're better doing it now, if you can. Kitting out a van is not rocket science, but not easy either! It time consuming getting the right van, then kitting it out. I wouldn't want to do it twice in 12 months! 

As I've mentioned before, my aim was wfp tops and trad bottoms. Within half an hour of my first day wfp I questioned my decision and poled the lot. Best decision I made.

I believe it's best for a single operator to start with a 500 litre upright tank. He may not use a full 500 litres to begin with, but once he gets established he will, especially on a good summer's day.

Not having enough water will throttle business growth.

 

[Jonny 67]

As I've mentioned before, my aim was wfp tops and trad bottoms. Within half an hour of my first day wfp I questioned my decision and poled the lot. Best decision I made.

I believe it's best for a single operator to start with a 500 litre upright tank. He may not use a full 500 litres to begin with, but once he gets established he will, especially on a good summer's day.

Not having enough water will throttle business growth.

I couldn't agree more ?. To ignore this advice would be foolish IMO....

 

[Pjj]

As I've mentioned before, my aim was wfp tops and trad bottoms. Within half an hour of my first day wfp I questioned my decision and poled the lot. Best decision I made.

I believe it's best for a single operator to start with a 500 litre upright tank. He may not use a full 500 litres to begin with, but once he gets established he will, especially on a good summer's day.

Not having enough water will throttle business growth.

Yes I agree 500 ltr would be a minimum for a sole operator working a full day at a reasonable speed I don’t understand how ones work all day with  350 and come home with water I have never achieved it and don't know anyone else that does either , unless they don’t  actually do much work and sit in the van drinking tea , or driving long distances between jobs , theses comments arnt a dig or criticising anyone just stating what I and my guys have found . My philosophy is you don’t have to fill a 500 ltr tank but you cannot add more  to a smaller tank , trying to put water from barrels into the main tank on a small van is a pita better off with a bigger tank in the first place . When I started off wfp I was already well established trad cleaner , I had a 650 ltr tank and would sometimes come home with 150 ltr of water but once I got going with wfp would near enough empty it working on my own every day working from 8:30-4:30 or 5:00 on reasonably compact domestic work . I didn’t waist water either it’s a fine balance between speed and efficiency and we are all different with the flow rate we use , also depends ware you are working costal work will need more water than country villages due to the salt and amount of dirt on the window each visit ,ware as country cottage in a sheltered  spot windows  might not have much dirt on them even after 8 weeks .