Hot water systems

[Part Timer]

Well I cannot believe that they would be better or easier, goes against everything I've learned about cleaning over the years.  Probably to keep the cost down.

How come you don't use it on maintenance cleans?

Because in my opinion it makes very little difference on maintenance cleans. Bought all the equipment when we first started, given the option of doing the same with my experience I, personally, wouldn't buy a 9kw hot water system. 

Better off warming the water in the tank for a fraction of the price. 

 

[steve garwood]

Because in my opinion it makes very little difference on maintenance cleans. Bought all the equipment when we first started, given the option of doing the same with my experience I, personally, wouldn't buy a 9kw hot water system. 

Better off warming the water in the tank for a fraction of the price. 

I fully agree with you. Up until last year I’d had a fogwash heater (gas) in my vans for around 6-7 years, maybe longer.

Yes it was nice to have warmer hoses, and yes, on first cleans it made it a bit easier. But for regular maintenance cleans I didn’t find much difference when I didn’t use it when the weather wasn’t cold.

I won’t replace it, managing just fine ?

 

[Lennie]

I'd say your problem might be too much dwell time on the glass, which is causing thermal shock. Faster, longer strokes, a good couple of swipes on the sill to start and finish and move on smartly to the next window. 

Last year my son cracked a pane when the customer came out for a chat and he kept washing the same window through lack of consentration. No great problem it was a downstairs window on a granny annexe and a local Doctor Glass fixed it a couple of days later at a fair price. 

Temperature : Up to 60 degrees in the tank and about half that by the time it's gone through the hoses. 

Speed is important, even more so with heated water on cold glass. I'd be aiming for 20 to 30 seconds on an average size wìndow with two main panes and a small top opener. Not much longer for the next size up. 

Good luck. ??

I was thinking the same thing, my colleague said

how come it never happens to me,

I said because you are not as thorough as I am,

to which he replied, yeah and look where it’s got you ?? and he’s right.

Need to give my ocd a talking to. 

We regularly use water  on glass at 65-70 degrees it’s so hot you cannot bare it on your hands , I do sometimes turn it down in the summer months but winter it’s flat out all day . We have Brocken two pains of glass in 5 years one was damaged behind the seal and the other was a new window fitted days before we cleaned it and it had been packed to tight in the frame , I agree with others comments dint keep the wager on one spot keep the brush moving this should stop thermal shock , there is a video on line of someone putting boiling water on a double glazed unit that has ice on it and the glass doesn’t crack , we have cleaned conservatories with ice on the frames and glass and never had a problem with the boiler flat out but Ona frosty morning the hose on the ground will loose quite a bit of heat anyway .

I use it slightly cooler in the winter because of the risk of thermal shock on the glass and generally stuff isn’t baked on the glass. I use it hotter in the summer as I find it easier to shift insect muck. 

Ive been using heated water for a while, but with the 5kw heater which only gets it warm. Since upgrading to the 9kw the water gets so much hotter and shifts the insect much much easier.  Like you say, can’t hold your fingers under it even at the brush. So probably need to adjust my cleaning style and be less thorough. 

I watched that video also, (squeaky clean Dave I think) and thought I would be ok. 

 

[Iron Giant]

About this time every year on every platform a hot water topic is started and people get all doey eyed, in more than 11 years of wfp I have never been tempted to have hot water as for my location and jobs it simply isn't needed, I worked through the winter of 2010-11 which was one of the coldest and worst winters on record and I managed just as well as lads with hot water in as much as I got to work when I could and managed just as well were as some were sat in the house even with hot water systems.

The one thing that will stop you in the winter will be snow on the ground and jam packed roads and estate roads were people won't get together and clear their road with their neighbours but sit in the house looking out of the window, even last year I think it was or the year before I simply wouldn't put my van in a street with churned up and piled up snow as I knew I would either get stuck driving through them or end up stuck after working for a while with the van sitting and compacting the snow, me and my neighbours clear our access road every year without fail to make sure we can get in and out safely. 

 

[scottish cleaning service]

I read most of the posts on here and gradually came to the optimum conclusion from all the posts, a bit like google does. I posted it months ago but we have short memories. A van that can hold 1200kgs, A tank that can hold 650l to 1000l of water, A hotwater system electric or 9kw diesel, Twin electric hosereels, An Extreme Pole or similar, RO DI filter system even if your tap water is 50tds and above especially in Scotland because we have no water meters, 70tds and below then DI only due to water cost should do in England & Wales and the biggest van one can buy. If you can manage to buy this set-up then your future will be bright and continue to shine. The ones on the forum who do really well have this set-up and never have problems which keeps them going non-stop. People who show a callous disregard for Experience are sure to repeat their mistakes continually and will never learn. Had a mate like that and finally all his working mates disowned him and his business collapsed because no one would help him. He blamed everyone bar himself and would never change but he doesn't need to change now as he has no work. 

 

[Part Timer]

I read most of the posts on here and gradually came to the optimum conclusion from all the posts, a bit like google does. I posted it months ago but we have short memories. A van that can hold 1200kgs, A tank that can hold 650l to 1000l of water, A hotwater system electric or 9kw diesel, Twin electric hosereels, An Extreme Pole or similar, RO DI filter system even if your tap water is 50tds and above especially in Scotland because we have no water meters, 70tds and below then DI only due to water cost should do in England & Wales and the biggest van one can buy. If you can manage to buy this set-up then your future will be bright and continue to shine. The ones on the forum who do really well have this set-up and never have problems which keeps them going non-stop. People who show a callous disregard for Experience are sure to repeat their mistakes continually and will never learn. Had a mate like that and finally all his working mates disowned him and his business collapsed because no one would help him. He blamed everyone bar himself and would never change but he doesn't need to change now as he has no work. 

Well I have all of the above and whilst I'm a relative newbie, company set up 2011 and since 2015 I've done it myself part time as I have another business. Turnover being in excess of a £1k a week yet I don't think a 9kw hot water system is a must have. 

 

[scottish cleaning service]

Well I have all of the above and whilst I'm a relative newbie, company set up 2011 and since 2015 I've done it myself part time as I have another business. Turnover being in excess of a £1k a week yet I don't think a 9kw hot water system is a must have. 

Well its time to change and post your results, i'm sure you won't be disappointed. I learned the word 'Optimum' in the Fire Service and wish i got told about it in school. One wants to ride the top of the bell curve for ever.

 

[Chris34]

When you look at how they manufacture cars everything is done to improve efficiency, reduce cost, improve quality control.  I think taking the same approach to any business makes sound business sense.   Therefore if the hot water makes a positive difference in any of those 3 areas then it should be used.  It might not make or break a business but if it gives the business an edge then you're leading the pack on the front foot. 

 

[Part Timer]

When you look at how they manufacture cars everything is done to improve efficiency, reduce cost, improve quality control.  I think taking the same approach to any business makes sound business sense.   Therefore if the hot water makes a positive difference in any of those 3 areas then it should be used.  It might not make or break a business but if it gives the business an edge then you're leading the pack on the front foot. 

Totally agree, however a 9kw heater isn't the most cost effective way to achieve this. If I was technically minded I'd be looking at using a hot box heater, they use them to heat water in pressure washing, and heating the water at the start of the day in the tank and insulating the tank.

Well its time to change and post your results, i'm sure you won't be disappointed. I learned the word 'Optimum' in the Fire Service and wish i got told about it in school. One wants to ride the top of the bell curve for ever.

I'm fairly sure I won't be told how to run my business either.

 

[Iron Giant]

Spending 3-4k on a water heater won't see me work much faster at all or improve/reduce the wear and tear on my body or magically increase my turnover, which is generally the 3 things I ask myself when investing in my business what will be the benefits, the vast majority of us are doing regular cleans which are never that dirty were as my learned friend @Pjj has perfectly outlined why it is a must for his business because of what he has to deal with cleaning coastal properties. 

Just don't tell anyone about my stockpile of Xtreme-II metal banded sections ?

 

[Iron Giant]

One wants to ride the top of the bell curve for ever.

Is that some kind of fetish, no wonder you like cleaning churches, does the vicar always find you've disappeared to the bell tower ?

 

[Chris34]

Spending 3-4k on a water heater won't see me work much faster at all or improve/reduce the wear and tear on my body or magically increase my turnover, which is generally the 3 things I ask myself when investing in my business what will be the benefits, the vast majority of us are doing regular cleans which are never that dirty were as my learned friend @Pjj has perfectly outlined why it is a must for his business because of what he has to deal with cleaning coastal properties. 

Just don't tell anyone about my stockpile of Xtreme-II metal banded sections ?

I agree, I wouldn't be rushing out to spend that either, but if I can heat the water before I go out and then it makes the day easier for less than £100 and then £3ish per day then it's well worth giving it a go.

 

[scottish cleaning service]

When winter arrives, we have to heat the van to prevent the water from freezing which doesn't heat the water. Much better to have a hot water system in place to heat the water. Immaterial if its diesel or electric but putting the energy into the water seems common sense up here anyway.

 

[steve garwood]

I read most of the posts on here and gradually came to the optimum conclusion from all the posts, a bit like google does. I posted it months ago but we have short memories. A van that can hold 1200kgs, A tank that can hold 650l to 1000l of water, A hotwater system electric or 9kw diesel, Twin electric hosereels, An Extreme Pole or similar, RO DI filter system even if your tap water is 50tds and above especially in Scotland because we have no water meters, 70tds and below then DI only due to water cost should do in England & Wales and the biggest van one can buy. If you can manage to buy this set-up then your future will be bright and continue to shine. The ones on the forum who do really well have this set-up and never have problems which keeps them going non-stop. People who show a callous disregard for Experience are sure to repeat their mistakes continually and will never learn. Had a mate like that and finally all his working mates disowned him and his business collapsed because no one would help him. He blamed everyone bar himself and would never change but he doesn't need to change now as he has no work. 

Don’t mean to sound offensive, but you keep banging on about results with hot, and disregard for experience, but I believe you have only been in this game for a very short while?

 

[Iron Giant]

I agree, I wouldn't be rushing out to spend that either, but if I can heat the water before I go out and then it makes the day easier for less than £100 and then £3ish per day then it's well worth giving it a go.

I bought a 1kw aquarium heater which I bought years ago which i use from time to time and gets the water to about 18c overnight , but found This Aquarium Heater which they say the water can heat up to 30c, the water would be warm by the time it hits the glass, but it would mean that your pump wouldn't working as hard through the winter, plus less the aggro and risk of cutting a hole in your tank and a potential issue with electric's 

 

[dazmond]

each to their own i say....investing in a professionally fitted 9kw diesel hot system is a luxury......granted....but it was a 25th anniversary present to myself for sticking at window cleaning so long......to go with my brand new van,PF electric reel and xtreme poles......this set up will last me many years and i have hot water on tap(with very little faff)every working day of the year,also i dont have to worry about anything freezing in the van due to the frost stat feature on my system.....im thinking more long term than changing my van every couple of years and the faff that goes with it...been there and done that many times....

for me i love it and it was a great investment,im already very well established and make a good living out of window cleaning so why not??

 

[scottish cleaning service]

Don’t mean to sound offensive, but you keep banging on about results with hot, and disregard for experience, but I believe you have only been in this game for a very short while?

Your right Steve but it was something that Tench0771 said last year. He said he always used hotwater even in the summer months because he was near the sea and bee pollen. This seemed to stick with me and i focused in on what folk with hot water systems replied to the idea. The more i thought about it the more it made sense not just for the glass but particularly the white frames. I cleaned a South facing front door with my wfp and it came up like new because the door was roasting. Did a degreaser test and the only thing that made a difference was the temperature of the water mixed with it. The higher the temperature the quicker the reaction seems to be the science behind it. Anyhow, my heater is still not working but will be soon. My experience of hotwater comes from what folk have said on the forum and nearly all have been positive.

 

[steve garwood]

Your right Steve but it was something that Tench0771 said last year. He said he always used hotwater even in the summer months because he was near the sea and bee pollen. This seemed to stick with me and i focused in on what folk with hot water systems replied to the idea. The more i thought about it the more it made sense not just for the glass but particularly the white frames. I cleaned a South facing front door with my wfp and it came up like new because the door was roasting. Did a degreaser test and the only thing that made a difference was the temperature of the water mixed with it. The higher the temperature the quicker the reaction seems to be the science behind it. Anyhow, my heater is still not working but will be soon. My experience of hotwater comes from what folk have said on the forum and nearly all have been positive.

“Your experience comes with what folk have said”. Strange sentence that ?

 

[Iron Giant]

@Chris34 I forgot to say previously my van goes in the garage on a night, so that will make a difference for me. 

 

[Chris34]

@Chris34 I forgot to say previously my van goes in the garage on a night, so that will make a difference for me. 

So does mine, it's underneath the house so I don't want to be starting any fires  :1f603: .  I'm some way off attempting anything yet though, currently still working with drums but I want to convert this to a single tank working from the van with a reel.  I also need to set up a water butt so I can fill up faster.  Want a univalve aswell, lots to do

 

[Ian Sheppard]

For those considering hot water systems. There is a V11 hot water ( frost stat) controller that will manage the pump in th usual way. It also has a output to switch a diesel heater. One of the useful features during the winter months is frost protection. The controller will switch the heater and pump for a short period to prevent over night freezing.

The controller would also work with a Gas heater to protect the system against frost. With a gas heater the controller woudl switch the pump to create circulation, this circulation will then get gas boiler running.

Remember to consider adequate ventilation of the heater gasses