Struggling with WFS

[Beeejayteee]

Hi guys, been window cleaning for 43 years, traditional. But decided nows the time to have a go at water fed. I've built my own system and it works really well. Water is at zero, I have a slx 22 gardiner pole with light head and medium brush, and a little bit of pure Sparkle in it but I'm not getting the finish. I'm taking my time, rinsing well but I'm getting runs and spotting. I don't have confidence in the job and I'm having to check and reclean a lot. What am I doing wrong?

 

[scottish cleaning service]

You can get oxidisation on the pvc so you need to give a good scrub and rinse then just clean the glass. Takes a few months till they are wfp proof. The vents can also be a nightmare which run after you are finished so you need to go round and check.

 

[Stratf01]

Hi guys, been window cleaning for 43 years, traditional. But decided nows the time to have a go at water fed. I've built my own system and it works really well. Water is at zero, I have a slx 22 gardiner pole with light head and medium brush, and a little bit of pure Sparkle in it but I'm not getting the finish. I'm taking my time, rinsing well but I'm getting runs and spotting. I don't have confidence in the job and I'm having to check and reclean a lot. What am I doing wrong?

I feel your pain mate as went through something very similar. ?

Only thing I'd add to your first excellent reply is to be mindful of what can happen when using wf when the sun is beating down on it if there's dirt around seals and frame. (Especially a first clean)

It can leave a sort of stain that is almost impossible to shift with the brush if you let it dry. Total nightmare ? Looks ok when wet till it starts drying. As Scottish cleaning says vents can be an enormous nightmare.
I ended up getting ladders and doing it trad style to get it off.

 

[Beeejayteee]

Thanks statf01, I have a whole estate with vents I'm fearing the worst! It looks like just a lot more scrubbing is needed.

 

[Stratf01]

Thanks statf01, I have a whole estate with vents I'm fearing the worst! It looks like just a lot more scrubbing is needed.

I'm only just coming to grips with things myself mate so don't listen too much to me I just very much feel what you are going through ?

I know many prefer to scrub the vents to prevent more issues but personally I try not to touch them much at all. If you do, realise you need to rinse rinse rinse then rinse some more.

I think maybe I will end up cleaning all customers vents properly but at moment I simply don't have the extra time and stress involved.

I took over from a family member not realising he avoided the vents like the plague and make a mess of a few windows thinking I was being super thorough ?

Anyway listen carefully to the guys here who really know what they are talking about. We sound like we are in same boat ?

 

[ched999uk]

I don't think you need Pure Sparkle just nice pure water will be fine.
Personally I would say on first cleans including cleans that have previously been done trad need lots of scrubbing then a very good rinse if not 2.
I believe that, depending on the seals, there can be soap trapped in the seals and when you start wfp that soap and dirt can leach out. Might be worth say cleaning & rinsing all the upstairs windows then go back to the start and rinse again. You will need a decent flow, not so much that the water is bouncing off the glass but enough to get the water to sheet on hydroscopic glass. You are trying to rinse away the dirty water and the bits from the glass and frame.

 

[Beeejayteee]

It's good to know I'm not alone and I appreciate your advice.

 

[Iron Giant]

It's good to know I'm not alone and I appreciate your advice.

You're definitely not alone because every single one of us has gone through the same thing

 

[spruce]

I don't think you need Pure Sparkle just nice pure water will be fine.
Personally I would say on first cleans including cleans that have previously been done trad need lots of scrubbing then a very good rinse if not 2.
I believe that, depending on the seals, there can be soap trapped in the seals and when you start wfp that soap and dirt can leach out. Might be worth say cleaning & rinsing all the upstairs windows then go back to the start and rinse again. You will need a decent flow, not so much that the water is bouncing off the glass but enough to get the water to sheet on hydroscopic glass. You are trying to rinse away the dirty water and the bits from the glass and frame.

Our first intro in wfp was a trad round. We bought a compact round where the cleaners only cleaned the glass. The frames were absolutely filthy. 9 out of 10 houses were dormers. The previous guys walked on the roofs. I wouldn't do that.

I started by washing, scrubbing and rinsing all windows on the first house, then went into the next house and did the same. In the warm May sunshine the windows dried enough to return back to the first house and rewash every window and frame again. Then started back at the second house and cleaned all those windows again.
Then repeated the process on the 3rd and 4th house.
I then went back to house 1 and 2 and checked each window and cleaned any streaks off the glass only.

Then repeated this on houses 3 and 4.

So each house got 3 visits during the day.

I managed 6 houses a day and used 500 litres of water. I was very disheartened after the first day but couldn't believe how clean the windows were when I returned the following day. I repeated that process everyday.

This was 19 years ago. Wfp was unknown and my new customers were very suspicious of us ( being South Africans) and this system. Yorkshire folk can be very distrusting.

Anyway, the second clean was fine and only had to reclean a couple of windows. Within a few cleans we were cleaning 15 to 16 houses a day and finished when the water ran out, usually just after lunch. We didn't have controllers, Univalves or Aquadaptors in those days.
We had Unger Ali poles with Vikan oval brushes, a far cry from the Gardiner poles and brushes available today. I didn't earn much doing the first clean.

The first day using a Varistream controller I managed 20 houses on that estate and worked all day. What took 3 weeks to clean first clean took 3 days a few cleans later.

We lost a couple of customers on converting but gained many more on that estate.
I ended up passing some of that work onto another cleaner 7 years ago. When I was introducing them, one lady specifically told us that she only wanted her windows done with the pole, NOT the old way. ?

Don't be scared of vents @Beeejayteee . Once vents are clean and you run the brush over them each clean, they aren't a problem.

 

[danzlfc]

I’ve found the best way for me personally is to do an extra thorough scrub of the top frame and rinse then clean the glass and other frames, sill and rinse, do the rest of the front upstairs windows like this, then back to the first one to just do one last rinse, repeat for the downstairs front, then move on to the side and so on, I’ve found this has worked for me with any first cleans without any issues. Keep at it and trying different things, it will be worth the hassle even though it might not feel that way right now. ?

 

[Yogi1872]

When I first switched over it was taking so long I wasn't covering running costs and the guys wage. It was taking ages and youl be thinking wtf have you done.

 

[Beeejayteee]

I am, I just don't want to leave a bad job, my customers aren't use to it. I'm just going to have to spend a loy more time initially.

 

[Iron Giant]

I am, I just don't want to leave a bad job, my customers aren't use to it. I'm just going to have to spend a loy more time initially.

A first will take up to 3x longer than a regular clean to get the frames up to standard, this what some people don't understand or undertake unfortunately

Which is why people have issues, it's a learning curve that once undertaken and perfected you'll have virtually zero issues

 

[Beeejayteee]

Cheers mate, there's been some good advice

 

[Marko067]

I remember within the first weeks of switching over and still building my confidence in the system bit by bit, a little boy walked past with his mum and asked her what I was doing. "Cleaning windows" she said. "Well" he said, "that's the stupidest thing I've ever seen". I laughed out loud at his honest comment whilst thinking to my self, "It feels like the stupidest thing I've ever done". This was after thirty years of doing it traditionally.
Now I absolutely love doing it this way. I often get comments from new customers such as "Amazing job mate. Thankyou very much". Makes me enjoy my work.
Keep at it Beeejayteee.

 

[Ocahan01]

Hi guys, been window cleaning for 43 years, traditional. But decided nows the time to have a go at water fed. I've built my own system and it works really well. Water is at zero, I have a slx 22 gardiner pole with light head and medium brush, and a little bit of pure Sparkle in it but I'm not getting the finish. I'm taking my time, rinsing well but I'm getting runs and spotting. I don't have confidence in the job and I'm having to check and reclean a lot. What am I doing wrong?

As someone who was cleaning trad for over 20 years I completely understand where you’re coming from. I ended up with serious anxiety when I switched over and as stupid as it sounds writing this now it was a really difficult period for me.
I had all the same fears about leaving a good job, pleasing customers and dealing with customers suspicions on the new method.

I know that initially I did leave some windows with a far from perfect job. The combination of not having an experienced technique, windows that had beeen done trad with soap (for years) and frames that were rarely cleaned unless asked all contributed to this.

My advice would be to perhaps convert your round in stages allowing you to take more time with first cleans and then perhaps supplement your wages with good paying trad through the week until you get your technique down. That way you won’t feel like you’re earning too little.

Like any new skill or job it just takes time. Time is also needed to rid windows frames and seals of soap and ground in dirt. Explain to your customers that the new system may well take time to leave the windows perfect but it the long run it’s a better more thorough job.

Just don’t give up and after a few times around your round you will be leaving a perfect job and above all else you’ll be earning more money than ever.

 

[scottish cleaning service]

I did a first clean today and above the vents was coated in black dust. First floor flat and I felt great after I had finished and so did my customer. WFP is a no brainer but it can take folk years to work it out.

 

[Beeejayteee]

I did a first clean today and above the vents was coated in black dust. First floor flat and I felt great after I had finished and so did my customer. WFP is a no brainer but it can take folk years to work it out.

You guys have certainly given some great advice, really appreciate it, thanks

 

[spruce]

Most windows have a top opener. Dirt and dust get on top and behind the opener along the top weather seal.

It's important to scrub and rinse all that dirt away. If you don't then dirty water is going to migrate down to the lower window and cause a streak. Especially is this true of windows with 2 top openers and a large window pane underneath.

 

[Stratf01]

Most windows have a top opener. Dirt and dust get on top and behind the opener along the top weather seal.

It's important to scrub and rinse all that dirt away. If you don't then dirty water is going to migrate down to the lower window and cause a streak. Especially is this true of windows with 2 top openers and a large window pane underneath.

Anyone else come across streaks you just created when openers or vents release loads of dirt that sun dried only to find the brush will not shift it?

I did a first clean not long ago and did windows realising they were dirty. By the time I got back to first window to give it another clean there were big streaks that laughed at my brush ?

Ended up getting ladder out and cleaning them trad style?

 

[Pjj]

It’s practice, practice, practice, with time your technique will improve and your confidence will grow , plenty of scrubbing and a good rinse first cleans can be a problem but 2,3 cleans will be a lot quicker practice on your own windows , clean any vents put well rinse the top frames well then good scrub on the sides and glass then rinse just the glass and side frames and sill let it dry a bit and then see what it looks like , we all have experienced this I nearly gave up initially the first clean will be the worst .