Ladder climbs i don't think about

[Iron Giant]

We also have a 20ft wfp and a portable resin filter that hooks up to a tap for the ones that are stupid to get to on a ladder

Possibly the reason some don't want wfp as if you are in the south in a hard water area with a tap tds of 200+ that portable resin filter will be no good at all, it will be like cleaning them with tap water and the windows will dry a mess. 

 

[Exchef93]

Possibly the reason some don't want wfp as if you are in the south in a hard water area with a tap tds of 200+ that portable resin filter will be no good at all, it will be like cleaning them with tap water and the windows will dry a mess. 

Without all the facts you dont know what your saying, im in the southwest, with some of the softest water in the country. Boss tests filter water weekly, if hes not happy with the reading he takes it and does a resin change.

Never had complaints from the people we use it on and it leaves the glass spotless.

 

[Cleanco]

I still use ladders on a daily basis although if I can get away with not doing I will. In some cases wfp’s and gutter vacs just simply don’t work or give the best results. Had a gutter clear last week and could not use the vac because of the tile overhang. 

 

[Mx19]

More die from driving related accidents/incidents than ladder related accidents/incidents...so assume you do not drive due to the inherrent risk involved in driving.

People do have accidents using ladders,but you do not hear mentioned the many many more people who do not have accidents using ladders in their daily working life..

The employer does have a duty of care......and more importantly legally EACH OF US HAVE A DUTY OF CARE for ourselves and others.

With all due respect rthe driving argument is bs. There are exponentially more journeys driven every day than ladders climbed!! Also driving is a necessity for the most part where as ladders aren’t! 
 

sorry, I keep out of the whole wfp/trad debate but that driving argument gets used for all sorts of things and is a load of ****. Rant over

 

[Tango]

Sorry but driving is an exmaple. I did not say it is better or worse than ladders. I merely pointed out that there are many complacent drivers on the road and many accidents to go with them.

The op is complacent about is unsafe ladder usage. I made a point about accidents happening because of complacency.

My reply was not a WFP vs Trad thing. It was a Safety vs Risk thing. You mentioning that it's a wfp/trad debate has just exposed you as a "windy-ist" LOL

 

[Iron Giant]

Without all the facts you dont know what your saying, im in the southwest, with some of the softest water in the country. Boss tests filter water weekly, if hes not happy with the reading he takes it and does a resin change.

Never had complaints from the people we use it on and it leaves the glass spotless.

Thanks, for now furnishing me with the facts, furnishing one with all the facts ensures the appropriate reply ? 

 

[Mx19]

Sorry but driving is an exmaple. I did not say it is better or worse than ladders. I merely pointed out that there are many complacent drivers on the road and many accidents to go with them.

The op is complacent about is unsafe ladder usage. I made a point about accidents happening because of complacency.

My reply was not a WFP vs Trad thing. It was a Safety vs Risk thing. You mentioning that it's a wfp/trad debate has just exposed you as a "windy-ist" LOL

Sorry mate, I wasn't replying to you. I was replying to Mike007 using the argument that more people die from driving so you shouldn't drive...

For the record, I do not condone the op's ladder use in any way...

 

[Dave B]

Sorry but driving is an exmaple. I did not say it is better or worse than ladders. I merely pointed out that there are many complacent drivers on the road and many accidents to go with them.

The op is complacent about is unsafe ladder usage. I made a point about accidents happening because of complacency.

My reply was not a WFP vs Trad thing. It was a Safety vs Risk thing. You mentioning that it's a wfp/trad debate has just exposed you as a "windy-ist" LOL

Undoubtedly my recent accident will be due to complacency as I "assumed" I would be fine.

29 years running up and down ladders and can still make a mistake. 

 

[Exchef93]

Undoubtedly my recent accident will be due to complacency as I "assumed" I would be fine.

29 years running up and down ladders and can still make a mistake. 

It's because you changed over to wfp... feet are on the ground to much now ? best leave the ladder work to the trads ?

 

[Dave B]

It's because you changed over to wfp... feet are on the ground to much now ? best leave the ladder work to the trads ?

Or maybe I could just earn decent money while the trad rats are clambering about on ladders risking their lives and taking forever about it.??????????

 

[Tango]

trad rats

Now now ladies lol

 

[P4dstar]

Or maybe I could just earn decent money while the trad rats are clambering about on ladders risking their lives and taking forever about it.??????????

 

[NoName]

ExChef you may soon be an ExWindie… it isn't us mummy boys WFP guys who tell HSE how to use ladders in the other way round...I know TWO windies hopsitallse by ladder falls - one airlifted so grave his injuries...

Problem? No Problem...

 

[Cleanco]

I don’t see what the problem is. Many tradesman still use ladders, like scaffolders and painters. Yes there are more options nowadays for windies 

but if they were that bad then why did most of us use them years ago instead of getting another job?? I wonder how many would be window cleaners if there was no wfp nowadays? We were all trad rats once, apart from the noobs who wouldn’t be were they are now without them so show a little respect. The op does deserve a little ear bashing for the way he’s started the thread as there no need to have a go at the lads that aren’t so keen on the idea of using ladders and vice versa. 

 

[Iron Giant]

I think we can all get a bit giddy about ladders vs wfp, ultimately it's about been safe, as @Dave B says complacency can catch you out and it only takes seconds for something to go wrong, no one wants anyone ending up in hospital or worse, I nearly ended spending the rest of my life in wheelchair from a 6ft fall with the ladder slipping out.

sit and think for a minute about how much your life would change if you ended up in a wheelchair!!

 

[mike007]

Sorry mate, I wasn't replying to you. I was replying to Mike007 using the argument that more people die from driving so you shouldn't drive...

For the record, I do not condone the op's ladder use in any way...

And I was using a example about risk attached to everything...and that WFP guys to always say how Ladders are death traps and anyone putting a foot on a rung must be suicidal!!.

 

[Master Jedi Alejandro]

I don’t see what the problem is. Many tradesman still use ladders, like scaffolders and painters. Yes there are more options nowadays for windies 

but if they were that bad then why did most of us use them years ago instead of getting another job?? I wonder how many would be window cleaners if there was no wfp nowadays? We were all trad rats once, apart from the noobs who wouldn’t be were they are now without them so show a little respect. The op does deserve a little ear bashing for the way he’s started the thread as there no need to have a go at the lads that aren’t so keen on the idea of using ladders and vice versa. 

Folk did what they did because they had too. But we don’t live in that world anymore, not at least in the West. My uncle use to walk along ledges 2 stories up to clean the Otherwise unreachable windows and his boss would pay him a bit extra for it. He admits himself it was mad but it’s what they did. But we don’t have to anymore, we don’t have to risk ourselves to put bread on the table so why do it? It’s not like it’s high reward for high risk. Like it’s been said most WFP cleaners make more than trad.
 

The point about other trades is also not 100% as no trade I can think of (and correct me if I’m wrong) move their ladders anywhere near as much as window cleaners. I watched a guy install a satellite dish up the side of a two story tenement, he did it off ladders. To me it looked mental. But he was obviously safe. But how many does he do a day? Three, four, five at a push? Even if he instead 10 a day he would still be no where near moving his ladders the number of times a window cleaner does! And this is the risk. Ladders are safe when used properly. The problem is we are humans and we make mistakes, not matter how experienced. 
 

However, this all being said it’s opinion for the most part. I have a idea that may or may not work. ??

 @Simply Business @Martin Holden you lot are in the business of risk assessment, would you be able to shed any light on it. For instance, is there a higher risk using ladders when window cleaning as suppose a painter?  

 

[Iron Giant]

The point about other trades is also not 100% as no trade I can think of (and correct me if I’m wrong) move their ladders anywhere near as much as window cleaners. I watched a guy install a satellite dish up the side of a two story tenement, he did it off ladders. To me it looked mental. But he was obviously safe. But how many does he do a day? Three, four, five at a push? Even if he instead 10 a day he would still be no where near moving his ladders the number of times a window cleaner does! And this is the risk. Ladders are safe when used properly. The problem is we are humans and we make mistakes, not matter how experienced.

I would guess on average a trad cleaner would move a ladder on a house 4x lets say and cleans 20 houses a day on average that's 80 ladder moves a day even if it was 60-70 moves a day, no other trade would move there ladder as much within any working day as a trad window cleaner, so the risk factor would be higher
 

 

[Cleanco]

Folk did what they did because they had too. But we don’t live in that world anymore, not at least in the West. My uncle use to walk along ledges 2 stories up to clean the Otherwise unreachable windows and his boss would pay him a bit extra for it. He admits himself it was mad but it’s what they did. But we don’t have to anymore, we don’t have to risk ourselves to put bread on the table so why do it? It’s not like it’s high reward for high risk. Like it’s been said most WFP cleaners make more than trad.
 

The point about other trades is also not 100% as no trade I can think of (and correct me if I’m wrong) move their ladders anywhere near as much as window cleaners. I watched a guy install a satellite dish up the side of a two story tenement, he did it off ladders. To me it looked mental. But he was obviously safe. But how many does he do a day? Three, four, five at a push? Even if he instead 10 a day he would still be no where near moving his ladders the number of times a window cleaner does! And this is the risk. Ladders are safe when used properly. The problem is we are humans and we make mistakes, not matter how experienced. 
 

However, this all being said it’s opinion for the most part. I have a idea that may or may not work. ??

 @Simply Business @Martin Holden you lot are in the business of risk assessment, would you be able to shed any light on it. For instance, is there a higher risk using ladders when window cleaning as suppose a painter?  

I would have thought the opposite. It doesn’t matter how many climbs you do but more importantly and where the risk comes is how long your spending up the ladder and window cleaners probs spend the least. I charge more if the custy requests a trad clean compared to wfp as it takes longer so I make the same weather trad of wfp. I’ve been at this for 20+ years and using wfp for over 15 of them and for me if you don’t use ladders at all then your doing one of two things. Selectively picking work that suits wfp or doing them anyway and making a mess. 

 

[scottish cleaning service]

Climbing ladders is now affecting my hip and my knees. I thought it would never happen but my age is catching up with me. If there is an easier way then I will be taking it, don't really discuss it with my customers now. Some have asked and I say its hot water, like steam cleaning and give me your thoughts on it.

 

[Exchef93]

 I’ve been at this for 20+ years and using wfp for over 15 of them and for me if you don’t use ladders at all then your doing one of two things. Selectively picking work that suits wfp or doing them anyway and making a mess. 

And if guys with wfp are doing this, that is what keeps trad cleaners in business. Until people with wfp will do a 100% jobs on every single property, trad the odd houses that have leaking windows, or get up to clean the balcony windows, they are always leaving a gap in the market for us.

If they go and do a property which isnt suitable for wfp, do a complete trash job, that customer will never use a windie with wfp again.... even if they move to a more suitable house, the bad taste is still there